12 replies to this topic

[thismoment]

During the first 6 months of discontinuation many of us encounter some pretty tough symptoms! Sometimes we feel like we might be dying! So we go the the ER. 

 

How many times did you go to the ER in the first months of withdrawal? I went twice.

[fishinghat]

Same here. Twice. Although the second time the dr told me to go home because they don't treat panic attacks and I was discharged. Bad night.

[Xanazul]

Never went to ER, because I was able to diagnose myself about not been experiencing a heart attack, a stroke or any other life threatening condition 

BUT despite of that this all (althogether with being progresively affraid of being into a relapse, which as you TM know I still am some days or moments) I had done:

*ECG, 

*EchoCG, 

*Stress test

*24 h Holter,

*Complete set of  lab test twice (including urinary catecholamine metabolites -in order to exclude a pheochromocytome as the cause for the adrenergic-like crisis I was (still am) having). 

*Had my colleagues cardiologist, nephrologist and  internist check my hypertension crisis (that are obviously  stress related as I had the opportunity to prove last week when I had a second Holter with event marker to signal any time I was feeling anxiety=hypertension spikes matched all the moments I had marked as being in an anxiety bout).

*Checked with one rheumatologist about joint pain and a few other related symptoms that I now can link to the moment I was weaning from 60 to 30 mg by alternating doses daily during two weeks (same applies to the first signs of hypertensive crisis -just small rises then- and anxiety -easily controlled at that moment yet)

*Checked with three different physicians specialists in rehabilitation (in Spain they are the ones that take care of muscle pain, neuropathic pain derived from back and spinal column...) two of them very dear friends (I point this out to underline the fact that I was not taken as a hypochondriac nor was I taken care in a negligent way either)

*Checked with two different psyquiatrist (one of them professor in the same MS were I teach Physiology, the other my therapist/friend)

 

Was only able to document:

 

*Hypertension crisis (systolic only) look like the adrenergic crises (sweeting, nausea, headaches), and are not related to any heart, kidney, lipid metabolism disfunction nor to diabetes onset or any other metabolic  disease.

*A SMALL BUT SIGNIFICANT INCREASE IN NORMETANEFRINE, the urinary metabolite of norepinephrine.

*Cardiovascular system working OK had not any ischemic signs during the stress test but: REACHED THE MAXIMUM HEART RATE after only two minutes, which prompted my friend cardiologist to think about the possibility of pheochromocytome that was later discarded.

*My leucocytes were consistently (three different test) a little over normal (which would point out to inmune response affected to some extend)

 

Nothing of what I was able to document may be considered as a sign of any pathology when taken separately, but I am physiologist and therefore by definition trained to consider the body functions both, in each one of its parts and as a whole.

 

All the above when taken together fits quite well as Cymbalta withdrawal resulting in a rebound and over stimulation of the mechanisms (including immunity, this will explain the flu-like, body aches, rash and a few other symptoms) that we use to cope with stress.

 

I wonder if these (and a few others I can think off) test were done in a significant population going through Cymbalta discontinuation we would not be able to document a pattern of measurable signs that will at least contribute to place the withdrawal as a serious condition to be addressed both by GP and psychiatrists/psychologists with more knowledge as well as compassion and efectiveness.

 

 

Unfortunately, this will require resources that no one seems to have or be interested in invest, so here we are my friends I guess that we are the first ones in a long chain of antidepressant withdrawal sufferers that will be left on their own before the paradigm of how to treat mood disorders changes, hopefully in a near furute.

[FiveNotions]

None.....in fact, going to the ER wasn't even something I considered.....I was so pissed at docs and the med/pharma system that I didn't want to expose myself to further harm....I didn't have any health insurance ....and, I was too damned sick to get there and then wait for 8-10 hrs (average in DC unless you're having a heart attack.....and I wasn't having panic attacks early on)

Then a couple months later, when the first big panic attack hit, I knew what it was....I coincidentally had an appt with the witch doc at the clinic where I had begun going (the one for low income folks with medicaid) so I just went there, confident that I'd get the emergency benzo supply I needed.....but the witch doc never bothered to show up....and they told me that he didn't respond to patient emergencies, that I should just go to the ER....

I knew then that I was well and truly on my own....dragged myself to the health store and bought theanine and tryptophan and my friend showed me how to do acupressure on the spammed diaphragm....and my friends here talked me through the worst of it....

[thismoment]

Xanazul

 

I went to the ER, but you had the ER come to you!!

 

I really like your post, and I think it goes a long way to exposing how discontinuation is a condition all its own, and it needs to be addressed. While the ER inquires about medication you are taking, they don't ask, "Did you recently stop some medication?" or, "Are you currently withdrawing from antidepressants or other similar medication?"

 

Good work.

[Wagtail]

Thankfully to all of you on here , I didn't need to get outside help ...whenever I felt like I was dying or relapsing I would come on here & read past posts to settle my fears.
You all wrapped your arms around me & made me feel safe ....much better than any ER .

Understanding & confirmation received from you guys stopped me from driving to the hospital a few times...

I'm still fighting the fight & praying that I will be able to one day live a normal life again, my main fear is that I am needing to take a small dose of Zanax to help me cope ...0.5 mg twice a day sometimes , that means that I am taking 1 mg a day for anxiety .
This is the only prescribed medication I take !.

[TryinginFL]

Wagtail... I feel the same as I consider a really "good day" a day w/o my Xanax (1 mg). I am happy for this as I was taking 2 mgs. every day a few weeks ago. Things are getting better...
I have started weaning off the Trazodone by taking only 25 mg instead of 50 each nite. So far, so good on that - just started this week.

I had an aqua fitness class this morning and am tired and a bit sore, but it is a good tired! Another class on Thurs. so hope to go these 2 days each week.

I also feel happy when I come to this site because of all the help and the kind wonderful friends that I have found here! Thank you all - this site is amazing!


Hugs,
Liz

[FiveNotions]

And here's another reason to avoid the ER

More patients flocking to emergency rooms under obamacare
http://www.courier-j...acare/10181349/

This is what happened to me...when I left my job last year (in large part because of the poison) I couldn't afford the $500 for COBRA to continue my top of the line blue cross plan....so, I shopped around, and found an individual plan that covered just what I needed (eg, I don't need neonatal and maternity coverage) ...at a reasonable price...$260 a month...definitely not top of the line, but it was accepted by all my excellent doctors....

Early fall, I got a letter from the company saying that due to obamacare they were no longer going to offer individual policies in DC...and mine would be cancelled...so, I checked out obama care plans here in the district, and the cheapest plan was $557 a month....With a huge deductible, and very limited rx coverage....low income folks like me now that I'm not working are eligible for "subsidies," but those are paid out at the end of the year....up until then, all non covered costs are out of pocket....

I ended up with no insurance, and then swallowed my pride and went on medicaid...

None of my good docs accept medicaid, and no others who I called do either. I ended up going to a tiny clinic, where the docs are lousy, only have 15 min max to spend with each patient, don't take emergency visits, don't return emergency calls...

I've been told "just go to the ER".....even before obamacare, ER waits here are typically anywhere from 4-8 hours...only if you've got a gunshot or stab wound, or a genuine about to die immediately crisis can you be seen immediately...or at least sooner...

[fishinghat]

FN

 

It is bad enough fighting medical isues without all the insurance issues. Even though I have 'good' insurance, due to my wife working, I find about one error in every 4 or 5 claims submitted. Then you have to call the insurance company and fight with them.

 

Also, don't forget about your low dose zoloft. You really need to get that jacked up so you can feel better.

[FiveNotions]

FH, I'm still not sure I need to be on the Zoloft....I'll take a 50 mg today...but I'd the anxiety stays stable I'm not thinking I'll continue the Zoloft...this should be posted over on the ssri thread...but here goes for direct response to you....

I took 1 mg of Valium at about 5 a.m......my last dose yesterday was 1 mg at 4 pm (I'm going to double check that now).....my current anxiety level is low...small waves...very small...with more time in between....

What's helping me the most is that I'm dealing with a couple of the major "life messes" I got into on the poison....both involving people....so far, I've had wonderful, positive responses ...each time, my anxiety drops....

I think if I stop trying to hold all this poop inside me...hiding it in shame...and start facing it...my anxiety will be cleared....I can't move on in recovery if I'm holding on to this stuff....it's what got me into these drugs in the first place...I've tried to hide things inside me because I didn't know how to deal with them in the real world...so instead they just fester...the drugs put a scab over the boil, but didn't lance it so it could heal....

Then again, maybe this isn't it, and I still need the Zoloft....I'm going to risk it for another couple of days....if it persists, I'll up the dose...have to do it on my own, because the witch doc has left the clinic...and the new one I was referred to can't see me for three months from last Friday.....

[fishinghat]

Well, FN, your post made entire sense. If you think you can handle the anxiety with the low dose benzo and some life changes. GREAT  That would be much better than taking the zoloft. There is only one way to find out and that is go for it. The longer you wait to come off the Zoloft the more withdrawal you will encounter. So far you haven't been taking a lot and not for too long. If you are going to discontinue the sooner the better (or maybe I should say the easier).

[gail]

Fivenotions, I wonder if the valium dosage you mentionned  is accurate.

 

I say this because 1mg of valium is equal to 1 tenth of 1mg of ativan.  It is like taking about nothing. Maybe you mean 10mg of valium.

 

If it is accurate and working, good, I would realy postpone the Zoloft.

[FiveNotions]

Hi Gail, nope...my rx is for the 2 mg tablets...which are scored and can be broken into two 1 mg tabs....If I took 10 mg in one single dose I'd be passed out! As it is, I took 14 mg between Friday noon and Saturday night....that whacked me out yesterday....

And, as it turns out, I should never have started the Zoloft...after just 4 days at 50 mg I'm having pretty bad side effects!

Jitters, increased insomnia, and when I close my eyes, even in a darkened room, I still see light...like a white screen....I thought it was the Valium excess, but it's not.....

I posted this, a bit more information I found on other chat boards, and an excerpt of the wiki article over on the ssri, snri thread just now....

So far today, I've needed no more Valium.....hopefully I can just get off that easily now....the Zoloft I'm afraid I may have to use titration...just for 4 days worth!