24 replies to this topic

[fishinghat]

Came off the Cymbalta over a year ago. Due to extreme fear during withdrawal I asked my dr for help. After trying 6 meds I was left with Ativan and Zoloft to help me out. Spent  a few months getting rid of the 6 meds that didn't work. This spring was time to come off the Ativan. I have come off Ativan twice before but this time it is much harder. I am only reducing it by 1% every 6 to 9 days. That is real slow but the withdrawal symptoms have been very light. Well so far so good until about 3 days ago. I was just getting over my last drop when suddenly I was overwhelmed by severe panic. I dealt with it for 24 hours before increasing my dosage of hydroxyzine. The dr had given me the extra hydroxyzine to help during withdrawal. It made my panic about 50% better. I am only 20% off the Ativan at this time so I have a long way to go. I am going to hold steady for a couple weeks and see if I settle down. If not and the panic remains then I may have to stay on Ativan. Strange. I had no problem getting down to that 20% level but now is a different ballgame.

 

 

[FiveNotions]

Total bummer, Fishinghat! What's your level of anxiety today, and how does it manifest? (Frozen, can't act... panic, or ...?)

 

I don't know if my experience with getting of Xanax can be applied to yours with Ativan ... but for what it's worth, I had similar "events" a number of times over the 2 years that I took to get off it ... I'll see if I can find my notes from those years to confirm this ...

 

But what I recall now is this ... I think I was taking somewhere between 12-16 mgs a day at the worst of my addiction ... and it didn't do anything for actual anxiety, it just "maintained" me ... 

 

I had no idea how to properly titrate off, so I was reducing the dose by scraping tiny tiny amounts off of the pills (sorta' like Carleeta with the nail file and the Ambien) ... and I was holding for a week or so at each tiny drop ... all would go along pretty smoothly that way, until I'd get to the point where I was down a full mg or a bit more  ... then, kaboom ... huge anxiety ...

 

I didn't have anything else to take for the anxiety, so what I did was to go back up a mg or so on the xanax ... and hold there for as long as it took for the anxiety to end ... then I'd start back down again ...

 

Have you considered going back up a bit on the Ativan?

 

Of course, my experience with the actual, underlying anxiety/panic was very different from what you were hit with and have been dealing with ... so maybe this is all apples and oranges ...

[thismoment]

FH

 

Sorry to hear you ran into that snag. Maybe it's the 'curse of the dregs' as you get down into the lower percentages of weaning.

[ShadyLady]

Hi, fishinghat...sorry you are in a glitch with the Ativan down dosing. Your honesty in sharing that warms my heart/soul as I see you as the Gentle Master of Wisdom on this forum as you continually share, educate & encourage the ones behind you in this discontinuation journey. God bless you, friend;)

[fishinghat]

My anxiety is moderate but very uncomfortable. Nervous, panicy, some hyperventilating. It is interesting to know that you had similar experience with the Xanax. I am real glad I had the extra hydroxyzine. When it first happened I had so much panic I had the shakes and was a mess. The drs say to never go back up on Ativan because it makes the withdrawal worse. I don't know but I sure don't want to find out.  lol

[FiveNotions]

Well, the doc I had at that time knew I was getting off (I'd ditched the one who let me get addicted), but never told me a decent way to do it, and never mentioned that going up a dose could make the withdrawal worse... so, who knows, I probably made that particular trip to hell all that much worse ... sigh ...

I'm praying for you FH!

[fishinghat]

Thanks FN. It is encouraging to know you had the same type of experience. That gave me a mental boost. Thanks again. On with the fight. lol

[TryinginFL]

Prayers for you FH...

 

I'm so sorry to hear of your returning anxiety.  So thankful that you have the hydroxyzine to help you out.  I hope this is a short-lived problem.

[gail]

FH, so sorry to hear this too.

 

I did upper the valium in the last 3 weeks, one day on two.

Sorry to say that clonidine did not work for me. Nor did hydroxizine.

 

That return of sympoms is just a real bummer, but, as we all know, it will pass. Much love.

[FiveNotions]

Gail, I'm so sorry to hear that the clonidine didn't help ... from your first reports, it sounded like it was a good possibility ... how's your anxiety level now, with just the valium?

[downtongirl]

Fishinghat...this may be the "kindling effect".  I had been on klonopin a sister to Ativan for several, several years and weaned off in 2009.  I really did not have much problem weaning myself off.  I went back on in 2011 and hit tolerance withdrawals last summer.  I finished my taper in April of this year.  Benzodiazepines are the hardest medicines to taper off of.  Check out benzobuddies.com.

[fishinghat]

Thanks for the reply Downtowngirl. You know I have come off clonazepam (generic Klonopin) and Ativan twice before with very little issues as long as I go slow. I would drop at 5-10% every 2 weeks with virtually no withdrawal. This time, because I was on it longer, I can only go at 1% per week which was fine until I ran into this big hit. I never took a hit like that during the other withdrawals. The good news is that I am about back to normal now. Of course I had to up my dose of hydroxyzine to get there. lol I would say I will be OK in about 2 or 3 days. At that time I am going to go back to my normal dosage of hydroxyzine and see if the symptoms return. If the symptoms don't come back I will just chaulk it up to a fluke and get back to my tapering.

I am a member of benzobuddies.com. However I am not a fan of their site. I have posted four times and have never gotten a reply. I also find their attitudes toward each other to be less than gracious most of the time. But I have read most of their entrees concerning Ativan and there is a lot of good info there.

[fishinghat]

Hey DTG I have a question for you. When you tapered of the Klonopin you obviously went slow. Did you run into sudden over the top symptoms like this or was it fairly consistent withdrawal?

[thismoment]

fishinghat

 

Could you give us some basic comparisons- similarities/differences between withdrawing from SSRI/SNRI vs benzodiazepines? Thank you.

[fishinghat]

If you do a slow withdrawal from a benzo like Ativan you it takes about 2 or 3 days for the symptoms to hit. It starts with 2 or 3 days of GI issues (bloating, diarrhea etc.) and that overlaps with about 3 or 4 days of moderate nervousness and restlessness. The next two or three days you return to normal and are ready for the next drop. To me this is a lot easier then the Cymbalta withdrawal. The symptoms there are constant day in and day out, only varying in intensity those first couple of months. At least with the benzos, if you withdraw correctly, the symptoms are uncomfortable but will not disrupt your life and every few days you get a break and that gives you a chance to catch your breath.

[fishinghat]

Oh, I am so stupid. Here I am concerned about this sudden panic I am having and that it is lasting too long to be from my benzo tapering. When my wife came home this evening she went into our home office and worked a while. After about an hour she came out and said to me "You do realize this has happened before during you weaning?"  "I did?" "No way I would remember that." I responded. Now I know better than to disagree with my wife when she has that tone of voice. She showed me my log notes and there it was. Twice before and both were one percent drops and I had to wait 24 to 30 days for things to settle. What an idiot. I keep a very precise journal and then never go read it. Why not? because I have such a great male ego. I would remember right? 

Wrong!!! Where was I when these two events happened recently? I should practice what I preach!!

[FiveNotions]

Wow, FH .... what a great spouse you've got! And, now you know that this is a pattern ... you dealt with it twice before, and you can deal with it this time as well!

 

It's also very helpful info for us here on the forum ... I sure wish I'd been doing a proper titration/weaning off the Xanax ... I'd love to know the exact point/dosage drop where my little "event" happened ....

 

Take the Mrs. out for dinner ... or, a fishing (but not catching) trip !

[brzghoff]

Oh, I am so stupid. Here I am concerned about this sudden panic I am having and that it is lasting too long to be from my benzo tapering. When my wife came home this evening she went into our home office and worked a while. After about an hour she came out and said to me "You do realize this has happened before during you weaning?"  "I did?" "No way I would remember that." I responded. Now I know better than to disagree with my wife when she has that tone of voice. She showed me my log notes and there it was. Twice before and both were one percent drops and I had to wait 24 to 30 days for things to settle. What an idiot. I keep a very precise journal and then never go read it. Why not? because I have such a great male ego. I would remember right? 

Wrong!!! Where was I when these two events happened recently? I should practice what I preach!!

 

i wish my husband would listen to me like that ;-)

[thismoment]

FH

 

Thanks for the note on benzos vs SS-SNRIs.

[fishinghat]

Your right FN. I feel a lot better after seeing that it happened before.

 

TM - Your welcome.

 

I hope you are both having a great day.

[downtongirl]

Fishinghat...I can only tell you my experiences with tapers over the years....I tapered myself off of 14 years of .5 mg 1 x a day of klonopin in 2009.  I noticed a tiny but of increase in anxiety once in a while but nothing major.  I tapered off of 150 mg of Effexor xr after 9 years of use.  The Effexor xr withdrawal was HELL!  It took me a year to do it and I had to use buspar and Prozac to get off of Effexor Xr.  I went back on Klonopin in the summer of 2011 after 2 years of being off.  This last duration of klonopin use lasted for 2 1/2 years and the highest dose I got up to was 1.5 mg broken up into  doses during the day/evening.  This last taper of klonopin was pure HELL on steroids.  It was even worse than the Effexor xr withdrawal.  I also tapered off of Cymbalta after a year of 60 mg 1 x a day previously by using Prozac to get off of it.  I do feel that the klonopin was the worse withdrawal.  I did go very slowly...ie...

 

1.5 mg spring 2013

1 mg summer 2013

.5 mg winter 2013

.25 mg March 2014

Last dose April 9 2014

 

I did not use the water titration method which would probably be easier.  I hope this helps.  Please let me know if you have any other questions.

[downtongirl]

Fishinghat if you don't mind me asking what is your regular dose of hydroxyzine and do you get good results from it?  Are you using it for sleep or anxiety or both?

[fishinghat]

I found interesting that your first time off Klonopin was easy and the last one hell. I came off Ativan easy the first two times but this time I am going at a snails pace. I also came off klonopin (generic) after 2 years. It was a slow taper but the only trouble I had was controlling my patience.lol

 

My normal hydroxyzine dose is 50 mg four times per day (They start you on 25 twice a day for a week to get you adjusted to the sleepiness). I can go as high as 100 mg 4 times per day if I need to. The neat thing is I can up the dose, stay there a month then drop back to normal without any kind of withdrawal symptom. I am using it for anxiety and it has worked very well but everyone is different.

 

Oh and by the way the water titration is the way to go as you can decrease at very slow speed if you need.

[downtongirl]

have you ever tried taking the hydroxyzine just at night to help with sleep?  I'm considering it.

[fishinghat]

One of my 50 mg doses falls at bedtime and it does a very good job of putting me to sleep. By the way it is commonly used as a sleep aide.