89 replies to this topic

[brzghoff]

You may have already read these first 3 "parts" below that I started over in Cymbalta in the news because i linked to a great article from the REBT network web site. i realize its more appropriate to post here. 

 

i don't mean to be self indulgent, but i am working though anxiety and getting it all down "on paper" so to speak is helpful in my fight, and hopefully there might be something buried  that can provide insight to others. some of this is repetitive since originally posted on three separate ocassions, feel free to "glaze over" if its too redundant 

 

 

part 1

 

when we're in the throes of high anxiety, its like having an out of body experience, a feeling that everything is spinning out of control. the reality is, nothing has changed except for what we are telling ourselves. one way we can help talk ourselves down before we get too high is to challenge the irrational circular thinking that ratchets up our anxiety.

 

this link leads to an article that is from the web site for the REBT (rational emotive behavioral therapy) Network. it outlines a number of examples of irrational thinking that can set the spiral of anxiety into motion

 

http://rebtnetwork.o...rary/ideas.html

 

please note, the author uses hyperbole to get his point across, for example, the first irrational concept addressed is: 

 

it is a dire necessity for an adult human being to be loved or approved by virtually every significant other person in his community.

 

most of us probably don't think that everyone should love us, but we may expect that someone in particular must love us, such as our children. you get the idea. i am a big fan of albert ellis, the founder of REBT. check it out.

 

part 2

 

i forgot to add that the inspiration for me posting this is because anxiety kicked in yesterday evening (after a good day) and i was working on getting my head "on right". it is therapeutic to post what is working for me, it helps reinforce my "lesson". it was a practice session.

 

no i don't know what the incident was that provoked the anxiety. daughter and family - including my 3 grandkids - arrive friday night and i am trying to get this place in order - and its actually going well, not much more to do. i am actually very excited! so i don't know if it was that or not. the feeling is much more physical, the heart rate and chest tightness. i guess just one of those things. we don't even know we are doing it to ourselves sometimes. my therp says sometimes we "worry about worrying" maybe that's it. it becomes a habit and we don't notice we're even doing it to ourselves. so that's one more irrational idea : even if i am not worrying now i might worry in the future and it would be awful to feel that anxiety and i couldn't stand it.

 

 i would like to add that cymbalta withdrawal certainly makes us vulnerable to anxiety where we weren't before. our own body and brain have lost the mental strength to recognize the irrationality for ourselves. even if it is due to cymbalta withdrawal, the process to recover is the same. while meds help us get to the place we can work on the cognitive skills, we have to work on that part too. we can't just depend on time to take care of it. kind of like where you break your leg and wear a cast. once you get the cast off, your leg is fixed, but your muscle has atrophied. you've got to work on rebuilding the muscle tone. you can't just sit around and wait for it to mend on its own. the analogy works for those who took the C for pain and not depression as well. your muscles would still atrophy if you didn't break your leg but wore a cast. anti-depressants are a "cast" on your brain. 

 

remember the "this is your brain, this is your brain on drugs" public service announcements? we could do one for the C, "this is your brain, this is your brain in a cast"

 

;-)

 

part 3

 

more thoughts i am posting that are helping me wrestle with the big bear of anxiety:

 

i posted over in the positives thread about family coming to visit. its been great, but not without taking a toll - or me allowing it to take a toll. anxiety requires permission to enter our consciousness, whether we realize it or not. chronic anxiety is a learned habit left over from when a repeated stressor triggered our fight or flight response to begin with. soon enough, it comes naturally with or without a trigger. the fear of fear. that is why its so darned difficult to treat, i must unlearn my habitual thought patterns. seems just when i think i have it licked, i find i still have a lot of work to do. the relationship to the C withdrawal is that when i was on the C, it masked the "result" of my irrational thought patterns - which is anxiety. in my case, before i took anti-d's i was depressed, but anxiety wasn't one of the symptoms. i think i got away with perpetuating irrational thinking that typically results in anxiety - but in my case, i didn't notice it until the C started leaving my system. of course withdrawal magnifies it. 

 

its not easy to deal with. even though i have strategies, controlling anxiety is a constant work in progress. i suspect it will be lifelong. anxiety at times is excruciating and if i don't watch it i start to tell myself "i can't stand it" . well i am here today to tell you i can. if i couldn't i wouldn't be typing this. if i can do it so can others.

 

i do take clonidine which works to help lower blood pressure and heart rate, which are physical manifestations of anxiety - caused by the rush of cortisol, the hormone that is produced by the adrenal gland located on our kidneys. our brains trigger the glands to produce the cortisol. the clonidine doesn't get rid of my irrational thinking, just the physical result. i still have to deal with the irrational thinking. relying on a drug, whether it be clonidine, benzos, or something else, mask symptoms they do not remove the root cause. i know we all must make our own decisions, but i won't take benzos because i struggle with anxiety everyday. if i rely on a benzo to knock it down, the anxiety will come back when i stop. benzos are addictive and eventually they will poop out and i would be in worse shape than prior to taking them. i try to limit the clonidine to night-time to help with sleep, but it is still a crutch, just not one with as devastating consequence as a benzo. i have high blood pressure, i guess that helps me rationalize taking clonidine its is used as a BP med. for me benzos are good for reducing anxiety due to a temporary situation such as fear of flying or getting an MRI. i know when my flight is over. i don't know when my anxiety will end.

 

gotta, go wish i could finish, i have interruptions going on right now

 

[ShadyLady]

Brz, THANK YOU for this topic/post! I had just found your original post, I guess when I was offline for a couple weeks I missed it. Once again, I had replied and my reply went up in smoke! Damn, that makes me angry. Anyway, have you had REBT therapy? I know you and several other members are proponents for the benefits of therapy/counseling. I have seen maybe 8 over the years and the "fit" was never there or the method was not helpful. Talk therapy, for me, was very destabilizing when I did continue with a couple therapists for 3 months once a week. I am reading of new therapies, for me anyway, and am curious what type of therapy has been successful for you and others who may read this. I KNOW I need therapy as the 'self help' online is not helping.

Anxiety has become crippling the last month. I am 5 months off the crap, but had to re-instate an anti-d as the depression and hopelessness was not manageable for me. Maybe because I didn't have the therapy tools or therapist in place to help in the discontinuation. I started Prozac 20mg about three weeks ago and am feeling a little improvement, I think;). I don't want to take an anti-d forever, but I have situational depression that I need good counseling to overcome first. Now, enter the dragon of anxiety. I have never experienced this type before so I'm not sure what it is. I thought panic attacks were anxiety! How do you define anxiety?

Again, thank you for sharing and your honesty. It helped me tremendously, a Godshot so to speak!

I hope others will chime in here with their ideas and what anxiety is to them. I'm afraid I'm confused:(, but I am struggling with an unnatural sense of fear toward most everything right now:0

Be well and take care, friend xxxxx

[TryinginFL]

Brz,

 

Thanks so much for putting this all together.  I believe it will be invaluable to our new members, as well as the "older" members such as myself!  I admire your courage as you seem to always search for new and improved ideas to deal with this monster.  I had never had anxiety in my life until I got off this crap.  I truly thought that I would lose my mind before I went on that Hawaii trip - I packed 3 times and still didn't get it right.

 

  BTW, my son and his bride are coming for a very short visit (I HATE that I always have to share him as his father and his wife live in N. Redington Beach -2 hrs away!).  It will still be wonderful to see them, as we really didn't have time to talk during all the chaos of the wedding and all the people.  At least I can look forward to this (without anxiety, I feel) and am even planning to bake his favorite - chocolate chip cookies!  I do very little cooking these days, since I am on my own here and it isn't worth the bother  -  plus I always have too many leftovers!

 

Shady,

 

I understand your feelings very well.  My anxiety was so bad that I was in the "frozen" state -  unable to do anything!   It really hit me at about 5-6 months off -  as you are. I have very little at this time, so believe me, it really does get better

 

I have been seeing the same therapist since shortly after I lost my daughter 5 years ago.  He has been my "crutch" so to speak, as I had to have someone to talk to.  No fun when there is no family near and no one else understands either - but then, they can't.  That's impossible when you haven't sailed in this boat.  I was to the point where I was almost ready to ask for another med to help me to deal with this, but that's when I changed PCPs again when the one I was going to wanted to put me back on the crap!   Thank God for the Alprazolam.  That's what got me through this even though I occasionally took an extra one when it got really bad.

 

Hang on, sweetie - you WILL conquer this!!

 

Much love, hugs and prayers to you both,

 

Liz

[ShadyLady]

Liz, so proud of you. You have weathered the storm and fought the battle valiantly! So glad to hear you have little anxiety and are sleeping better.

Btw, congrats on being a 'God-like!' I just noticed that!! You are such a support for all of us and so compassionate and knowledgeable with the newbies coming aboard regularly.

Blessings, my dear & thank you for the encouragement, as always, muuaahh xxxxxx

[brzghoff]

TFL:

 

i love it when you said "no one else understands either - but then, they can't.  That's impossible when you haven't sailed in this boat "

 

that is so true!

 

Shady: 

 

thanks again for the props. glad my ramblings can help. i am just thankful this group is a safe place to put it all down. its really a very self-ish endeavor for me to take up all this room with my posts, but when it is out there for all the world to see - i am forcing myself to walk my talk! thats where the healing begins. 

 

the anxiety was ratcheting up while preparing for the family visit and the extended family gathering. once that was over and i got to focus on having fun with the grandkids it was like, what anxiety? as soon as they left for the beach... it's ba-ack! two days later we joined them for the day, jumping around in the surf and building sandcastles. again, my anxiety was nowhere to be seen. after coming back home, the next morning, i was freaking out over the littlest things, coming up with the biggest "what ifs" and scaring myself half to death... my anxiety saying, "trick or treat !"

 

my plan of action to overcome it is the same... i know what to do. but it seems like it will be so easy when i am sharing my strategy with others. when its time to face it and actually do the work... its hard!

 

i will say, it is getting better. i don't doubt it will get worse at times, there is that back and forth we all know too well. but overall, i am getting better, the good moments/good days outweigh the bad more and more as time goes on

[brzghoff]

by the way, i did this and i melted in my chair. didn't help my blood pressure, but it is great for anxiety. 10 minute guided meditation

 

http://youtu.be/xoYnqvadurg

 

see below i got it to work

Edited by brzghoff, 31 October 2014 - 10:12 PM.

[brzghoff]

i don't know if this will work, this web site is creating many probs for me this afternoon. this SHOULD be a nice 10 minute guided meditation, good for anxiety

 

[brzghoff]

anxiety has kept at bay for the last couple days. on monday we were able to take advantage of some comp passes to disney to take the grandkids to - the magic kingdom. we are not a big fan of disney, but there is nohing like seeing the face of a 6 year old taking in the wonder of it all. she has rarely seen an actual tv show in her entire life and hasn't been exposed to much media in general. she only knows about disney from the classic books - and is allowed to watch certain age appropriate disney movies on DVD. she didn't even know the park existed until a few days before we took her. as a result, no expectations. i don't know what was better, seeing her excitement and laughter or her genuine gratitude for what a special time it was. 

 

the family flies back home tomorrow except for our teenage grandson who will stay with us for an extra week. i sincerely doubt anxiety will be much of a problem if at all. what i need to learn now is how to implement the thought patterns i posses for the rest of the week through the rest of my life.

[gail]

Hello Brz, out of likes.

You seem to be doing so well.
Nice trip to Disney, lovely to see your satisfaction.

You speak of anxiety, thought patterns. I like that.
But I must say that at times, anxiety is not always linked to thinking patterns.

That is my case more often than not. I can recognize the difference between the two. One you can work on and the other, well, time is the essence.

I am in the hell of the second one for the moment and can barely breath. And that could be over by tomorrow, God, I hope so.

Had to speak about this, after a five week calmness, it is back.

I am happy for you Brz, nice to read your post.

[TryinginFL]

brz,

 

Wonderful to hear that your anxiety is beginning to leave you alone.  Being at Disney with your granddaughter gave it no time to attack  -  so happy that she was so filled with joy!

 

Enjoy your week with your grandson   --  again, you will not have the time for the anxiety!  Hoooraaay!!!

 

Have a wonderful time

 

Liz

[TryinginFL]

gail,

 

I'm so sorry that your anxiety is back.  After 5 weeks?  awww...what a bummer!

 

Hopefully tomorrow will be better -- I know how crippling it can be.  Don't we wonder if this will ever stop - not just abate for a time.

 

You remain in my thoughts and prayers, dear friend

 

Liz

[gail]

Thank you Liz,

Progress is not linear, FH used to say this.

Today is another day, who knows what it will hold?

As I was asking God for a favor like 15 minutes ago, I lift my head to look outside, and I see this bird passing by, so white, like a dove.

I felt that God was really listening. It felt good.

Editing this, eight hours later, a much better day, no anxiety. As I am tapering the Valium, allmost forgot to take them, good sign!

[brzghoff]

Hello Brz, out of likes.

You seem to be doing so well.
Nice trip to Disney, lovely to see your satisfaction.

You speak of anxiety, thought patterns. I like that.
But I must say that at times, anxiety is not always linked to thinking patterns.

That is my case more often than not. I can recognize the difference between the two. One you can work on and the other, well, time is the essence.

I am in the hell of the second one for the moment and can barely breath. And that could be over by tomorrow, God, I hope so.

Had to speak about this, after a five week calmness, it is back.

I am happy for you Brz, nice to read your post.

 

 

i am sorry to hear about your recent relapse after five weeks of calmness. i hope by the time you find this it has passed. you said you can tell the difference between the two types of anxiety. i was curious what that difference is. you mentioned being in hell and can barely breath. is it all physical? can you describe the mental component? i love what you said to liz about the bird passing by and how you felt that God is listening. a classic example of "being in the moment" - anxiety doesn't have a chance when we stay in the present. it only lives in the future.

 

i do experience two types of anxiety. there is the general anxiety that can consume me 24/7 and while distressing and uncomfortable can be "managed", however i can disturb myself into thinking i can't stand it when i can.  that type of anxiety is crippling in that it wears me down and affects my ability to make rational decisions. i am full of "worry" and it feels very uncomfortable. what i can work on is "challenging" that which i tell myself. i quit my job at the end of feb by choice. we can afford it for the next year, money is tight - but we can afford it. we wanted to focus on restoring a new property and my job, which i disliked, got in the way. once i weaned off cymbalta i was very vulnerable, as we all are, to stress/worry. i started worrying about money all the time. rational thinking would suggest, if you're that worried, get another job. however, due to the withdrawal symptoms, it wasn't a good time to get another job even if i wanted to. so i allowed myself to get into the cyclical thinking of no money, need a job, can't work because i am too sick, can't get a job, no money… and back again. nothing had really changed. we actually had the financial resources that we did when i made the decision in the first place. money was tight but i knew that going into the decision to quit. what changed was how i looked at the situation. it wasn't a good time to get a job. but instead of accepting that i chose to worry about a situation that wasn't going to change. i was giving birth to anxiety.

 

for me, the second type is more like a panic attack. its more physical. for me there is no "worry" component - and there is no thought pattern to change or disrupt - at least when it is happening. shear terror, yes. worry, no.  one of the cognitive skills used to deal with anxiety is "being in the moment" however, when suffering a panic attack, that is the last moment you want to be in! ;-). it just has to pass.

 

the cognitive piece that i work on in regard to the 2nd is by not assuming that just because i had a panic attack at the grocery store last week that it will happen again. my therapist works with me on changing a thought pattern from "what if" to "what is". instead of thinking what might happen. i must focus on what is happening: at the moment,  i'm not having a panic attack and i need to go to the grocery store. just because i had a panic attack when i went to the grocery store last time isn't enough evidence to suggest it will happen again. i am the one who ended up creating the repetitive trigger but beating myself up with the "what if" thought pattern. thats what turns a single out of the blue, non thought-pattern related panic attack into a "repeat performance". the initial panic attack is something that is either the result of a real threat from the past - like being attacked during a carjacking - or from the changes to brain chemistry as a result of drugs, like cymbalta. the return of the attacks is classic PTSD response. if the original "panic" occurred at the grocery store, i begin to associate the grocery store with having another. next thing i know i won't go out anywhere at all. classic agoraphobia. my therapist challenges me with "okay so WHAT IF you have a panic attack at the grocery store?" he then asks me if it will kill me. i say no. he asks what would be the result of a panic attack at the grocery store and i tell him, someone might have to call 911 and it would be embarrassing. he then asks "is it deadly?" and i say no, but it could be expensive. he then reminds me there are a lot of unknowns that are expensive. those are the discussions i have with my doc based on my circumstances, everyone is different. i can't speak for others but you get the idea of where these conversations go for me and how they help me. the grocery store is an easy one to explain. triggers can be very subtle and hard to identify.

 

for me, wrestling with the first type of anxiety is harder because it is more pervasive. its there all the time to some degree and requires constant work. at least for now. the idea is for me to develop good thought patterns/ "habits" that become second nature so controlling anxiety isn't such a conscious effort. 

[gail]

Hello Brz,

When I say I see the difference between the two, I mean that one can be caused by external factors and the other one just happens.

That is the one where I have to force myself to breathe, can't wait for the Valium time to come, I just want out. Nothing happens to trigger it. Of course my mind starts over thinking, let this be over.
I rack my brain to find a reason, can't find anything, and when I can't explain it, it doubles in strength.

As for the other on caused by thinking that I will have no money to keep me going, or that I will age alone, maybe be sick, or something like that, this one has reasons. It happens, but the other anxiety prevails.

The last twenty months were of this nature. Feeling so bad inside, wondering how I would go through the day and asking God to come and get me.

And the last six weeks calmed down a great deal. Editing this part, have to go off seroquel, nightmares side effect.

I see much progress, but I am no fined tuned yet. My social worker is great for giving tricks to alleviate all this.

The therapy you are talking about, I went through that many years ago, I was afraid of loosing conscience at the supermarket for one, and our dialogue was pretty much the same you are having.

But this one(anxiety) is different. We are working it in a different way. No panic attacks here, just pure anxiety. Coming out of fucking nowhere, nothing conscient that I know of.

Now, I am going to the library, and to the chapel. I feel this little monster inside, but it does not prevent me to go out when I have to or want to.

Thanks for listening, and, gosh, I forgot to take the Valium 30 minutes ago, good sign.

Since I don't know how to edit parts, doing the best I can, I took off the seroquel part, which did me good for a while, now withdrawing from it. How can something so right turn out so wrong!

[kathyms3150]

Gail, That's the kind of anxiety I have, it comes out of nowhere. I wake up with it and just want to crawl out of my skin. It used to respond to benzos, but my body has become tolerant to them. I know what you mean about asking God to just take me. Sending you hugs.

[gail]

Kathy, have you tried changing the benzos?

If you remember Fishinghat saying that after a year, at times less, we end up tolerant. The protocole is to switch to another one, and so on every year. But we do have members that get relief from the same benzo after years on it.

I went from ativan to Valium, a much longer half life, easier to taper.

In the process of this, and if all goes well, should be off by next summer or so. Hugs to you also.

[gail]

Edited post number 14, don't really know how to do it.

If someone could tell me how to scratch things off, please tell me.

[kathyms3150]

Hi Gail, I've tried Xanax,Valium and Klonopin which I currently take. Yes, I do remember Fishinghat saying that we can easily build up a tolerance to them. I've also tried things like Clonidine, Seroquel and Hydroxizine. Right now I'm taking something called Perphenazine. Some of them sort of take the edge off the anxiety but I can still feel it. I'm not sure if my anxiety is so bad as a result of taking the poison or if it's just me. I'm really trying to hang on but it's so hard. I wish you luck tapering off the Valium. Hugs.

[brzghoff]

gail,

 

i don't know how you feel, but i hear what you are saying. it breaks my heart when i read about you asking for "god to come and get me". i am glad that you are working with a counselor/therapist. you mentioned "we are working it a different way". is there a specific strategy? it sounds as though you like her/him

 

the dialog i described i apply to virtually any situation where i begin to "disturb" myself, causing frustration, anxiety, anger, rage or another "intolerable" emotion - circumstances change but the self talk remains the same. the panic attack example is just one application of the same strategy. most often it is not apparant as to what is causing my anxiety - the money example is a situation where i can identify the cause, but the anxiety showed up before my awareness of what triggered it. it doesn't take long before my anxiety doesn't need a trigger, its a habit. it is the self talk i've got to change for me to get better. what i tell myself is the way out. i CAN stand it, it won't last forever, i will get through this. sometimes i feel it overwhelm me and i choose to confront it head on. i mentioned awhile ago about how i will have a "staring contest" with my anxiety and eventually it blinks and looks away. 

 

that you "forgot to take the valium" IS a great sign! i am concerned about the benzos. its great you are working on reducing the valium and anticipate being off it next year i didn't know you were weaning.  as fishing hat has said, you build up a tolerance. however, switching from one to another when that happens can make the anxiety worse in the long run. so glad you're cutting it down. benzos are meant for short term use. some shorter term than others. it is true that doctors prescribe them without many if any limits, they've already demonstrated that they are clueless about cymbalta and the related withdrawal as well. 

 

both you and kathy are two strong women and i have faith that you will get through this. i am having good days recently - i've had the wonderful distraction of family in town - but i have to be real and recognize that my usual routine will soon return and things can go the other way, so i try to learn how not to get discouraged and focus on one day at a time. 

 

to draw a line through text: when you hit "edit" you will see the tool bar above where you type and you will see a letter S with a line through it, highlight the desired text and then click on the  S 

[gail]

Hi Gail, I've tried Xanax,Valium and Klonopin which I currently take. Yes, I do remember Fishinghat saying that we can easily build up a tolerance to them. I've also tried things like Clonidine, Seroquel and Hydroxizine. Right now I'm taking something called Perphenazine. Some of them sort of take the edge off the anxiety but I can still feel it. I'm not sure if my anxiety is so bad as a result of taking the poison or if it's just me. I'm really trying to hang on but it's so hard. I wish you luck tapering off the Valium. Hugs.

Kathy, same here, I don't know if it is the poison or me.
I was not like that two years ago. Sure I had a bit of anxiety but never like this.

[gail]

Brz, as for specific strategies, here is an example when working with what I call pure anxiety.

I have a client or patient to whom I attend to twice a week. When I go in, and anxiety is at the door, I can't wait to get out of there, and when I come out, I can feel this unease, tension, go back home feeling this great anxiety, can't relax. All the way home, I feel this monster that does not relent for hours.

Suggestions are the following. To have in the car a scarf that I love, am a fan of scarves. To have a special drink in the car, mine is a bottle of lemon tea.

So I get in the car, take out my special scarf, enroll it around my neck. Then have the lemon tea. If that does not alleviate the anxiety during my way back, change route, stop at the grocery even just for an apple.

I applied that for a while, and it really helped. Don't need it any longer, but the scarf and bottle remain in the car and are used for that purpose only.

Simple things to make us feel special. Or cuddled.

Thanks for the info about editing, can't do that on a tablet.

Feeling good today, by the way. Thanks Brz for your kind words.

[brzghoff]

thanks for sharing the "different approach" - i am adding it to my arsenal. like giving yourself a hug and comfort. i like that.

 

i have heard that tablets, especially ipads, are a challenge with some of the features on this forum. i am old school. desktop and a laptop - i recently lost my cell phone, an oldfashioned, flip phone. was given an iphone 4 that a relative was replacing, big learning curve. i am very computer savvy but smart phones and their touchscreens are awkward, especially for us older folks with bad eyesight ;-)

[gail]

Brz, those flip phones were the best.

I had one many years ago given to me by a boyfriend, I rarely used it. He gave it to me so he could know wherever I was. Jealous type....but at least I could hear well with it.

No cell phones for me, I can barely hear the person talking, moving it up and down, makes me mad. When I am with my friend and have to make a call from his cell, you should see me, I just want to throw it fifty feet from me, I hate it. Hang up fast, well, no, I don't even know how to put it off...goes to say, I am from the dynausor ages.

[brzghoff]

we dropped the landline. at&t is the only carrier where i live - a rural area (there is no cable service out here at all!) the only way to dump them for the competition was to just use cell service. when they are the only game in town for service, the price goes up, the quality goes down and customer service doesn't exist. saved us almost $100 a month. 

[kathyms3150]

Kathy, same here, I don't know if it is the poison or me.
I was not like that two years ago. Sure I had a bit of anxiety but never like this.

Gail, I also had anxiety before and even sometimes on the Cymbalta, but never so unrelenting. Tomorrow I'm seeing my doctor but I don't have any hope that she'll be able to help me. My depression is very bad and as much as I don't want to go on more medication I really don't think I have a choice.

[gail]

My dear Kathy,

Nobody wishes to go on medication, nobody.

At this point, something has to give. Are you on hormones? Like estrogen or progestin?

If my med is giving me to hard a time, that will be my next step, was on natural progesterone which I could not tolerate.
I have a prescription for provera, but waiting it out.

Trial and error, how I hate this, to begin anew on something that you don't know if it will work.

But, do we have a choice when worst comes to worst? No

Good luck with your doctor, keep hope Kathy,xx

[kathyms3150]

My dear Kathy,
Nobody wishes to go on medication, nobody.
At this point, something has to give. Are you on hormones? Like estrogen or progestin?
If my med is giving me to hard a time, that will be my next step, was on natural progesterone which I could not tolerate.
I have a prescription for provera, but waiting it out.
Trial and error, how I hate this, to begin anew on something that you don't know if it will work.
But, do we have a choice when worst comes to worst? No
Good luck with your doctor, keep hope Kathy,xx

Hi Gail, I went through menopause in my mid forties and took natural hormones, but I took them for physical symptoms. I've struggled with depression and anxiety since my teens and the only med that ever helped me was Cymbalta (unfortunately). Last year I noticed it was becoming ineffective and decided to go off of it. I've tried lots of therapy but it never helped. Now as much as I fear meds I'm going to have to try to find something to help, though given my past history of not responding well to meds it isn't going to be easy. I can't go on feeling this way, I have no quality of life. My doctor's office called this morning and changed my appointment to tomorrow. xxxx

[gail]

No Kathy, you cannot go on feeling this way, as Thismoment always said, quality of life comes first.

Perhaps a combo of medication can help. But which one?

Many people cannot get relief on just one med, they add something else to it.

You may get tips from the Healing Well forum for depression. It is worth looking it up.

Thinking and praying for you and all of us that are suffering, xxx

[kathyms3150]

Hi Gail, I just got home from my doctor, she prescribed Pamelor. It's an old antidepressant that I was on many years ago. I don't think that it helped me then but maybe it will in combination with something else. I hate starting on the merry go round of meds again but I can't live this way, quality of life does come first. My fear is that it won't help. Thank you for mentioning the Healing Well site, I'll check it out. My prayers are also with you and everyone suffering. xxxx

[gail]

Kathy, hello,

We don't know before we try it, a waiting game that is not fun.

It can't be worse than what you are going through.

Don't we just hate to take something new.
Give it a chance, it could be the one. If you check that site, you will see that you are not alone in this waiting game.

Good luck, keep me posted, I care xxxx