51 replies to this topic

[citrusbliss]

Dear Fishinghat,  I'm stubborn and often seem to prefer banging my head against the wall instead of changing course...that's the honest truth as to why I didn't slow down and stabilize at 30mg and go slower...even though I hurt myself. 

 

So, I see my doc in about an hour and I'll just be honest and ask for her opinion...and then see if she understands what C withdrawal really entails. I don't have to do anything really. Just keep at 30 and very slowly wean myself down as you have pointed out to me. I just get going on a mission and want to keep pushing myself...ahem, hence the anxiety and depression that caught up with me a few years ago.  

 

To top it off I'm reading the book 'The Power of Patience" by M.J. Ryan. I'm really trying to work with myself on some level )

 

Again, thank you for the response. Do you ever get tired of having to repeat yourself to impatient monkeys like us newbies????

[fishinghat]

No problem. I remember that when I was going through withdrawal I was 'coached' by a member called Green Machine. I liked to drove him crazy with basically the same questions over and over and the same fears/worries. He was so patient with me. I think that the lack of clarity of thought and cognition is a significant part of Cymbalta withdrawal. Don't worry. I understand. You just hang in there.Like I always say. Time and patience.

[citrusbliss]

Good Morning!  

 

I'm back up to pre-bead counting 30mg of duloxetine and feeling so much better.

My impatience with the quitting process pushed me to go too fast with the bead counting and made me very sick.

So, after checking with my GP yesterday, we agreed that stabilizing back up to 30 mg for a few weeks or however long it takes is best and then checking back in with her for consultation on the next step.

She would not agree to cross tapering onto Prozac or prescribing any other type of drug at the moment. She's more concerned with my current mental/body health than throwing more drugs into my system.

It's a sensible approach and after experiencing the force of C withdrawal I'm on board!

I wish I could speed up the process but it's not worth the pain.

At least while stabalizing I can resume my back exercises, some daily walking and looking forward to the coming baseball season 

[fishinghat]

Wow!!!

 

A dr with some common sense. Keep that one they are rare!!

 

I am so glad they didn't put you on another ssri with a new set of possible side effects.

[gail]

Citrus, good move!

[citrusbliss]

Yes, I'm very lucky to have her...she has seen me through time off work for back pain, years of physio that didn't help, applying for long term disability due to back pain and depression/anxiety/panic attacks, finding a good psychologist, 2 separate spinal fusion surgeries...to the present. Five years of jumping (hobbling lol) through work insurance hoops, enough to send anyone down into the dark pit of despair.

 

I considered suicide at some points, not because I wanted to die but because I just wanted the pain and constant feeling of threat to stop.  I'm lucky to still be here and trying my best to get better, with lots of help and support.

 

And here I am today talking to you and baking a pumpkin pie. I'm sitting here sobbing, so glad and grateful to be alive  . I will slowly and surely kick duloxetine's beady little behind!!!!!

[fishinghat]

Boy can I understand. My wife has had 3 discectomies including two emergency ones which had half compressed her spinal cord which resulted in partial numbness and lack of blood flow to her right calf/foot. She has had cervical fusion and still suffers from foraminal stenosis at two different vertebrae. In addition she had an artificial disc installed to help her at one of the locations of her discectomy. Three months of pain and suffering to finally wind up where she started at. She also has nerve damage at L5/S1 from scare tissue buildup from surgeries. which results in hyperaesthsia of the grain area which requires daily topical numbing so she can wear clothes. This numbing lasts about 12 hours and after that the only think she can wear is a bathrobe or long T-shirt.  She also has degeneration of her vertebrae. Lots of pain meds and still works although I don't know how.

[citrusbliss]

Wow! Your wife is incredibly strong to endure all of the pain and intrusive procedures and you are obviously a supportive husband. Backs and spines are mysterious to the medical world and often we're not believed when we say we have pain and specialists differ so much in their diagnosis.  

 

I had a spondylolisthesis at L5-S1 and was forced to wait for 15 years to have fusion surgery because "it wasn't bad enough". I was using a walker and virtually housebound by the time I was approved for surgery and then only bone graft was used so the surgery failed!!

I ended up back to using a walker and hardly walking since now both legs were burning with sciatic nerve pain. I finally asked to be referred to another orthopedic surgeon who told me in no uncertain terms that a fusion on a spondylolisthesis requires hardware in order to be successful...he performed the revision surgery within a month saying he would not leave me in such pain for any length of time. He did x-rays, CAT scan and MRI, the works, before surgery was set so he definitely had a good plan in place. I still use a cane and still have pain, can't drive yet, but not looking at any more surgeries.

 

I understand about your wife's scar tissue pain and how much invisible, residual pain we are left to cope with after surgery. It's inspiring to hear about your wife, thank you for sharing.

[citrusbliss]

Citrus, good move!

Exactly the same recommendations I was given on this site! I need to slow down and hopefully after a few weeks I can go one bead at a time )

I hope you're doing well Gail.

[fishinghat]

Thank you for your kind words Citrus.  I would do anything for her she is my world. When I had my nervous breakdown in 2002 she would set up at night and comfort me. She is such a blessing. 

[gail]

Fisherman, can scar tissue be seen by a scan? And can it show up after 7 month surgery?
Does lidocaine help with that kind of pain? If so, can you get it over the counter?
Thanks Einstein!

[citrusbliss]

Gail, thank you for your info on Benadryl Total. I really needed it today and it's given me some relief. Guess I'm getting used to the higher dose of 30 mg again... 

[gail]

Citrus, the first time that I took Benadryl Total, I felt so normal and so calm.

I really thought that is was a miracle and that withdrawal was over.
Since I cold turkeyed at 15 mg, just after 5 months of disastrous effects, it was a blessing!

As I said before, use it in emergencies.

Time for supper, delicious squid with Cole slaw!

[fishinghat]

Gail, in general scar tissue after 8 to 12 weeks after a surgery but can continue to develop and stiffen up to 1 year after the surgery depending on how extensive a surgery was performed.

 

Scar tissue can be difficult to tell on a cat scan and only a little bit better on a MRI. It really depends on the density of the tissue around it.

 

The pain associated with scar tissue typically falls in 2 categories. The pain from the scar tissue trying to stretch (this is common after  a hernia repair) and pain from the scar directly effecting a nerve. Lidocaine is effective typically on both but can only be applied topically.  Over the counter cream is 4% lidocaine and prescription is 5%. and is usually embedded in a patch that can be placed over the effected area. In either case use as directed as using to much over a extended period can be habit forming and result in a withdrawal syndrome.

 

Let me know if you have any other questions Gail and take care of yourself.

[gail]

Thanks Einstein, the thing is that where the scar is, after the nephrectomy, does not cause any problem. I have developed, recently, a pain that is situated where my left kidney used to be. So I thought that it could be "scar tissue" from inside where the kidney used to be.

The scar is in front and the pain is in the back. Does that make sense? The surgeon said that it was probably muscular. Let's just say that with the anxiety disorder and this, it throws me off.

Should it be like this after 2 weeks, he said that he would have a scan. But otherwise, blood test shows that all is normal and that the right kidney is working perfectly.

So, scar tissue, can it be where there is no outside scar and just somewhere inside where the kidney used to be? Oh boy, am I ever bothered by this! Thanks for your time. Crying.

[fishinghat]

Oh don't cry gail. This is typical, even to be expected. Anytime tissue is damaged it forms some scar tissue.

 

The dr did an incision in your skin to gain access, damage, so a surface scar. He had to cut through some muscle in the abdominal wall and then sow it back up afterward, damage, scar tissue and of course he had I am sure to remove the kidney, more cutting and more scar tissue. The problem with scar tissue is that it doesn't stretch like muscles, tendons, blood vessels, etc. So after the tissue starts to heal the scar tissue forms and begins to stiffen. This means that if you twist, turn, bend, etc it pulls not only on your sutures but also on the scar tissue and this causes pain. Happens every time. the dr gave you some restrictions on physical activity, such as a weight limit of say 10 lbs. This is to keep the stress off the fresh incision while it heals. Be sure and follow the limits he set and do not overdo it. Incisions and scar tissues take 4 to 6 weeks to toughen up. During that time take it easy. When the dr blesses you will full activity then you need to start stretching. Find at what angle of twist, bend, rotate that you feel the discomfort. A few times each day stretch that area. Do not stretch enough to cause bad pain, just enough to pull on the area until uncomfortable. Relax and then repeat several times. Usually the scar tissue can be stretched out over a 3 or 4 month period and your range of motion can return to normal with no pain.

 

This happened to be after my hernia surgery. After 4 weeks the dr said I was cleared for physical activity with no weight restriction. I had a lot of tightness in that area and could not twist or bend without discomfort. I stretched out the area 2 or 3 times a day and within a couple months could move like normal with no discomfort. Your surgery is more involved than a hernia repair so it might take longer. Remember, time and patience...but nothing to worry about, perfectly normal.

[gail]

You are a blessing in disguise. Thank you for that advice, I will follow it strictly.

Now, it would have been nice from the urologist sergeon to mention this. Real nice!
Instead of take 2 Tylenol's.

I am at a point that I am so vulnerable, crying comes easy. The hamster in my head is in full force because of this. I will rely on your advice and you explained it perfectly. Never heard that from the specialist!

Are you taking any new clients??? Love to your lovely wife, you are blessed and so is she.
Thank you again!

[fishinghat]

"Are you taking any new clients???"

 

Always willing to 'consult'. Don't dry Gail, just lean on the Lord. Have faith he will take care of you. Call on him and he will respond.

 

I am hoping the best for my gal Gail in Canada.

 

Blessings

[gail]

Thanks, I needed this!
Reminders always help.

[martay76]

Havent been on in a little while.  Really thought I was doing okay with my tapering, been bead counting and I am down to 20mg a day now.  Probably going too fast but really honestly have not been having the issues I had in the beginning.  At least until yesterday...Holy Cow!  I had some MAJOR anxiety happening and even called my physician to see if I could get something to help.  Naturally they call when I am in a meeting I couldn't step out of so I called back and OF COURSE she calls me back while I am walking through the wine aisle at the store.  So here's the crazy lady trying to whisper her CRAZY anxiety symptoms into the phone while loading up her cart with alcohol.  Thank goodness today is much better!!  I don't know how people can cope with anxiety like that on a daily basis!  I have worked in mental health for the past 20 years and I can say coming off of this medication has definitely given me a whole new perspective!!

[TryinginFL]

Hi martay!

 

The anxiety was one of the worst things for me as it lasted for so long...I took Alprazolam (1mg) often 3 times a day. This was 3 yrs ago and I never experienced anxiety before - now it visits occasionally but not as badly as that first yr.

 

FH or Gail have probably mentioned hydroxyzine or clonidine for that anxiety or even Benadryl.   No withdrawal with these but the Benadryl will poop out if used too often.

 

Also you are at a point in weaning where slowing down is recommended - the lower you get the worse the symptoms.  Please stay where you are for a while and then I would suggest weaning by a lower number of beads and wait a few days in between.  This is not a race!  It just takes as long as it takes and the object is to try to be as comfortable as possible.

 

Take care and hang in there!!

[fishinghat]

TFL hit it right on. Stop at your current dose until stable and then start tapering more slowly. Don't be surprised if you have to slow down a couple more times before you are done. You are doing well. Patience is required at this time. lol