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is what i am feeling normal???


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#1 Donnie1974

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    Going thru very rough time with cymbalta and Xanax withdraw need some feedback

Posted 20 November 2009 - 11:22 PM

ok i thought i was over the withdraw, now i'm feeling worse, i have a major decline in energy, my anxiety is back with vengance, all i do is sleep, i feel depressed, tired all the time, dont want to leave my bedroom, feel scared, feel like there is doom right around the corner and my panic attacks and my hypochondria is coming back along with agorophobia... i need something to take the edge off, but i don have health insurance and don't know what to do... is this normal ,,,,,,,???????

please resond

thank you

#2 nursedeborah

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    I am reallly trying to get off Cymbalta, and not having, well I am having nightmares even with the decreased does, and clanging in my head.

    I just found this site, and I really need help, I can't do this, I fear I willl never get off this brutal medication.

    Deboreah Wesson

Posted 21 November 2009 - 12:36 PM

ok i thought i was over the withdraw, now i'm feeling worse, i have a major decline in energy, my anxiety is back with vengance, all i do is sleep, i feel depressed, tired all the time, dont want to leave my bedroom, feel scared, feel like there is doom right around the corner and my panic attacks and my hypochondria is coming back along with agorophobia... i need something to take the edge off, but i don have health insurance and don't know what to do... is this normal ,,,,,,,???????

please resond

thank you

Donnie,
Welcome.
How long ago did you stop taking this crap? How did you take yourself off of it?
Your having all of the normal signs of withdrawls big time!! Yes it's normal for
so many of us to get hit hard by the withdrawls, some don't, all depends on how
your came off it.

For me even doing a slow wean has not been all that great at times, in fact I have
so much of what you have right now, on it, and during the withdrawls.

Get back , and let us know how you got off, what does, and for how long.
We are here to help, and support you through all of this.

Debbie

#3 Donnie1974

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Posted 21 November 2009 - 03:23 PM

i have been off the xanax and cmbalta for about 5 weeks now, see i thought i was over the withdraw side effects because i was feeling better about two weeks ago but then bang!!!! all these new fellings started, the tirdness, the panic, the agorophia, the general fear and hypocrondia, in general just feeling horrible in my own skin.... the way i got off this medicine , like i said in eairler threads, was stupid and was forced by economics, i stopped cold turkey... if any of this help please let me know...

thanks don

#4 Junior

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Posted 21 November 2009 - 07:22 PM

Hi Don

Sorry you are having such a hard time. If you've been off Cymbalta for 5 weeks, it's my guess you're pretty much through the withdrawal by now. Having said that, people on a Paxil forum talk about having 'waves' months later, so it could be a factor. However, I've heard that people have a more difficult time coming off benzodiazepines like Xanax so it may be that that is your problem. Could you possibly afford to get back on a low dose, then wean off more gradually?

I hate how economics is such a big part of the health system in the US. It really shouldn't be like that. One wonders about the Human Rights aspect....

Kind regards
Junior

#5 Donnie1974

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Posted 21 November 2009 - 07:45 PM

it could be the Xanax since i was on it for almost 8 years and when i stopped cold turkey my dose was 3mg of xanax XR and 1-2 mg of regular xanax... i cant afford the Xanax XR its 130.00 for generic for a month, thats crazy for a generic!!! and we all know cymbalta is not cheap without health insurance... it is a shame the way our health care system works.... i guess if this doe not get any better soon i'll have to break down and have to go to my local V.A. hospital, which i am dreading...

#6 Junior

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Posted 21 November 2009 - 07:54 PM

That's a pretty high dose of Xanax. I was speaking to my psychiatrist the other day and he said that Xanax is more addictive than Valium! Could you go to your local ER?

People should NOT be treated this way. It makes my blood boil. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
In Australia all taxpayers contribute to Medicare, which, in turn, means that we have public hospitals (where we can be treated for free, although there is usually a waiting list) and have 85% of the schedule fee for medical doctors refunded. We also have a federal govt scheme called the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme which funds part of the cost of many of the drugs people take regularly. We rarely pay more than about $35 for a drug. Pensioners pay $5.20
Maybe you should move here? LOL!

Thinking of you
Junior

#7 Donnie1974

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Posted 21 November 2009 - 09:27 PM

well i called my psychiatrist and told him what i was going thru, well his response was that i owed him 50.00$ for a missed appointment, so he would not call in any medicine in for me to the pharmacy until i paid the 50.00$ miss apointment fee, which enraged me bc, how can a doctor who took an oath to help people refuse me medicince because of a 50.00$ charge, so i called my family doc today that i have been seeing since i was 13, he just told me to go to the emergency room.. which if i do will end up costing me a bill in the amount of 2,000.00$ plus... it is very agervating that the health care system over her is so so so fubared.... i was in the military for some time so i do quailify for veterans benifits, but that in it self is enough to cause panic attacks, dealing with the veterans hospitial... it's sad that i'm really thinking that i should just buy some off the street so i can feel a little bit better... i have been in my bedroom for over a month, first with the withdraw, and now with the reoccuring panic and anxiety... it's a vicious cycle....

#8 Junior

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Posted 21 November 2009 - 09:49 PM

Donnie

I am so sorry that you have to go through this and I agree, your health system sucks. I can't believe that your psych won't help you until you pay him the $50 you owe him. FFS! I'm sure he's not struggling to put a meal on the table. Grrrrrrrrrrr. As far as the Hippocratic Oath, I've often wondered about that myself. They are supposed to 'do no harm'. Well what is he doing right now?

I wish I knew what to tell you but I don't know enough about how your system works. All I can suggest is that when the worst of the panic wells up, try deep breathing. It's not much I know but it might help a little.

Thinking of you
Junior

#9 MaureenV

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Posted 22 November 2009 - 04:57 AM

Hi Donnie,

It's so frustrating for those of us in other countries which otherwise have a similar standard of living to the US, hear that people are just left 'hanging' when it comes to needing medical services or prescriptions.

Ours in Australia wasn't always like this, but has been since the mid 1970s, so long enough for it to seem acceptable that health care and prescriptions are a human right, not a privilege of the well off, employed, and those fortunate enough to have access to ongoing insurance. Bad in the 'bad old days' before this system, one relative had very premature twins (as in three months premature); in order to pay the hospital bills, he had to work two jobs, which of course put his marriage under massive pressure (and it eventually ended) as his wife was trying to look after three children, two of whom was very fragile (one twin died along the way). I'm assuming that's still how it is in the US for someone without insurance. Not really sure how it all works, but believe some sort of changes have passed through the system recently??

None of which helps you now. One of the problems we DO have in Australia is that in the countryside, the small population is spread over a vast area, so medical services are thin on the ground in most isolated areas. For this reason our Victorian state Government, in conjunction with a local university, have set up a (free) site which is designed to help those with little or no access to face to face services.

This is the link:

http://www.anxietyonline.org.au/

There are no businesses etc trying to sell you things; no ads on the site; no 'natural' alternatives being pushed in your face.

You can go through and do whichever assessment you feel is suitable for you.

THEN, based on the result of that, there is a FREE 12 week self directed course.

(There is also provision for access to psychologists, for which fees are charged, because part of the site's objective is to help those who can afford help, but are too isolated to be able to access it.)

If it's any use at all, one of the few things I clearly remember from my yoga classes decades ago is to focus on the jaw.

When we were doing relaxation, they'd take us through from the scalp, right through to the toes; we'd tense them, then relax, then when breathing out, trying to make ourselves as 'heavy' as possible. When they got to the jaw, we had to stretch our mouth open, then completely relax it without closing it completely. After every other few bits of the body, they kept coming back to the jaw, to remind us that the mouth should be slightly open.

I find this amazingly useful for getting back to sleep on those nights when we're our own worst enemy - lying there allowing ourselves to think about (and worry unnecessarily about!) everything under the sun.

I've had times when this is useless (menopause wakefulness which is quite different would be an example), but if it's just your everyday garden variety of lying away, or being anxious generally, it works well.

If you try it, remember to focus in turn on every little piece of your body: scalp, ears, eyes, eyelids, forehead - then keep working your way down your body. Tense then relax, deep breath, then let it out slowly and try to feel 'heavy'. To some extent focusing on all of this takes our mind off the things we're anxious about.


If it only 'takes the edge' off it it may be worthwhile for you.


take care, Maureen.

#10 nursedeborah

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    I am reallly trying to get off Cymbalta, and not having, well I am having nightmares even with the decreased does, and clanging in my head.

    I just found this site, and I really need help, I can't do this, I fear I willl never get off this brutal medication.

    Deboreah Wesson

Posted 22 November 2009 - 01:14 PM

Don,
We all have a different opinion, but to be honest with you, your done with
the detoxing of the Xanax. It only takes about 7-10 days, it is not an easy
detox. As far as you stilll having withdrawls from going off the Cymablta
cold turkey, or even if you would have done a slow wean, we are all different.

Some don't get off that easy to have to over in just several weeks, I still talk
to some other people who are going through hell, myself included. I do think this
drug has just done different damages to different people.

Get to the ER, and get treated, they can't get blood from a rock, and you are
able to get Medical, whcih would then pay for your meds, and to see a doctor.

Yes our medical stinks, but if you know the right steps to take, you can get
treatment in the US, and for free.

Are you going to file for Social Security? I think that would be another option.
Here is their number 1 800 772 1213

Hang in there you are not alone. I have been home for 4 days, and can't do anything.

Debbie

#11 Donnie1974

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Posted 22 November 2009 - 05:37 PM

I have applied for social security; however at my age my gf and her family are giving me flack for doing so because they think is a cop out, it's hard for other ppl to understand what these toxic presription drugs can do to your life, most ppl think that, only "street drugs" can screw up your life.. People wo don't deal with panic disorder or depression can't wrap their head around it, I like all of us on this site and the other support sites never asked for the conditions that lead us to to being guinea pigs for the shrinks. I remember when cymbalta first came out around 2003 I think, every shrink was giving it out like it was candy like it was the end all of all psych drugs, I find it a disgrace that the drug reps, the doctors and the insurance companies really don't care about ppl just the bottom line of the profits, the kick backs and the pushing of new drugs in order to get their name out there, I mean this is not like pushing a new soft drink, this is serious mind altering drugs that re wire your brain!!!! Between the health care system and my 10 yrs plus in the service I am very let down by this country and if had the means would leave. We will never have health care like other countries do because of the economics of it all. If I could go back I would never of took these drugs from the doctors. Being pushed aside bc of not having insurance goes againg every oath every doctor took and yet they get away with it, if I went against my oath with the military I would of been locked up. Where is the balance ?

And I have to disagree with you as far as Xanax detox goes, I was told by many doctors, and read that the detox has time has a lot to do with how long you were on it and how much you were taking, I'm not a doctor and only have very limited medical training as an emt that I don't even do ant more so I could as well be wrong. One doc told me that someone like me who has been on those two drugs that long at a high does that it may take a full year before my brain re wires itself back to whatever is normal, who knows?? I have known ppl who took the wrong path in life and got hooked on heroin , every heroin attict that I have spoke to has said that it is raiser and safer to kick heroin than it is Xanax.

I should of just stood on the basic ssri's instead of cymbata.

#12 Donnie1974

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Posted 22 November 2009 - 05:51 PM

I have applied for social security; however at my age my gf and her family are giving me flack for doing so because they think is a cop out, it's hard for other ppl to understand what these toxic presription drugs can do to your life, most ppl think that, only "street drugs" can screw up your life.. People wo don't deal with panic disorder or depression can't wrap their head around it, I like all of us on this site and the other support sites never asked for the conditions that lead us to to being guinea pigs for the shrinks. I remember when cymbalta first came out around 2003 I think, every shrink was giving it out like it was candy like it was the end all of all psych drugs, I find it a disgrace that the drug reps, the doctors and the insurance companies really don't care about ppl just the bottom line of the profits, the kick backs and the pushing of new drugs in order to get their name out there, I mean this is not like pushing a new soft drink, this is serious mind altering drugs that re wire your brain!!!! Between the health care system and my 10 yrs plus in the service I am very let down by this country and if had the means would leave. We will never have health care like other countries do because of the economics of it all. If I could go back I would never of took these drugs from the doctors. Being pushed aside bc of not having insurance goes againg every oath every doctor took and yet they get away with it, if I went against my oath with the military I would of been locked up. Where is the balance ?

And I have to disagree with you as far as Xanax detox goes, I was told by many doctors, and read that the detox has time has a lot to do with how long you were on it and how much you were taking, I'm not a doctor and only have very limited medical training as an emt that I don't even do ant more so I could as well be wrong. One doc told me that someone like me who has been on those two drugs that long at a high does that it may take a full year before my brain re wires itself back to whatever is normal, who knows?? I have known ppl who took the wrong path in life and got hooked on heroin , every heroin attict that I have spoke to has said that it is raiser and safer to kick heroin than it is Xanax.

I should of just stood on the basic ssri's instead of cymbata.

#13 Donnie1974

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Posted 22 November 2009 - 05:52 PM

Sorry that was posted twice , I'm on my phone and had a call so I screwed up ;-(

#14 Junior

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Posted 23 November 2009 - 05:15 AM

You are allowed to screw up occasionally. We'll let you ;-)

Donnie, I really feel for you and people who have to deal with health system in the US. It never ceases to amaze me that doctors will cut off the supply of drugs like Cymbalta because they are owed small sums of money. Like you, I can't understand how that fits in with their code of ethics. I've studied 4th yr psychology, including ethics, and it's just WRONG, WRONG, WRONG. Among other things, they have a Duty of Care to their patients and I really can't see how cutting off medication suddenly... aahhhh.. what's the point? I don't even LIVE in the US so there is nothing I can do. I just know this:
(a) psychiatrists there hand out medication willy nilly, (ours probably do too but it's not so driven by economics)
(b) psychs either don't know or don't want to know about the difficulty people have in coming off many of the anti-depressants
© helping people is switching to or adding more drugs
(d) money rules

With applying for social security, you are right, there is no need to feel ashamed or inferior. Mental illness is not about being 'crazy' and needing to be put in an institution. It is real and valid. It has biological underpinnings. It is just as real as having a broken leg, only people can't see a 'broken' brain! Thankfully here in Australia, the stigma is beginning to lift. We've had sporting stars admit to suffering from depression, a former politician started an awareness program called "Beyond Blue", and people are beginning to talk about their experiences more. Society is gradually realising that it can happen to anyone. It has a long way to go and a LOT more resources need to put 'out there', but it is improving. I hope that the USA goes the same way in the not too distant future. Can you tell I'm passionate about this? LOL!

Oh..and I can't believe that advertising of these drugs is allowed in the USA. That really amazes me. Surely it is up to a Dr to decide what is appropriate for a person and what is not? That sort of advertising is illegal here.

Finally, you are right about the Xanax. I spoke to my own psychiatrist just last week and he informed me that Xanax is up the higher end of the benzos in terms of addiction. Like anti-d's, it's not just getting off it, it's the time it takes for the brain to return to it's pre-Xanax way of functioning. I haven't had to deal with benzo addiction myself, but I've heard others say that it's worse than getting off anti-d's. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news. I hope your own experience is more pleasant.

Kind regards
Junior

#15 Junior

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Posted 23 November 2009 - 05:18 AM

Oh, forgot to tell you, there are some good psychological therapies out there for sufferers of depression and panic disorder. Some people swear by Cognitive Behavioural Therapy. I believe Interpersonal Therapy is good for depression also. Also, Claire Weekes has some good info about how to manage Panic Disorder. You might want to google her.

Cheers
Junior

#16 nursedeborah

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    I am reallly trying to get off Cymbalta, and not having, well I am having nightmares even with the decreased does, and clanging in my head.

    I just found this site, and I really need help, I can't do this, I fear I willl never get off this brutal medication.

    Deboreah Wesson

Posted 23 November 2009 - 01:56 PM

Donnie,
When I was talking about the Xanax, I was not talking about long it would take for
a person to get back to "Normal" I was only talking about how long it takes to detox
off of it.

Again I am in recovery, and I had done it all, and yes Xanax is an awful one to do,
the worst for me now is the Cymbalta, and that they say is harder to get off of than
Heroin, or Oxycotin. At least with those drugs you can get a detox protocol, with
Cymbalta, it looks like most are just given something for anxiety, or started on
Prozac 20 mg.

I am on your side as far as the insurance, and just about everthing else, but where
I feel that we do have so much in common is the severity of anxiety, leaving the
house, these withdrawls.

Be good to yourself.

Debbie

#17 crosswordsmile

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Posted 27 November 2009 - 11:55 PM

Hi Donnie,

I was very affected by your thread on this message board and the responses. I joined because I thought that it would be helpful for me to get involved in discussions as a way to practice speaking back to my own irrational, anxious, and depressive thoughts that have resulted from the withdrawals.

I have been weaning off the drug for almost a month now; my psychiatrist told me to do it VERY slowly, recommending 3 week intervals between lowering doses, or even more time if I needed it. The whole process is to take about 3 months for me, in fact. I was on 60 mg, and after 3 weeks dropped down to 40, then from there to 30 which is where I am at now. Eventually I will go to 20, 10 and then off completely.

Even with the slow weaning process, dropping down to 30 mg has been quite painful for me the last few days, so I can't even imagine what you are feeling. It's been 6 days since your last posting so I'm hoping that's a sign that you're feeling better. It's been so nice to read these postings and know that I'm not alone. I too have been terribly afraid of psychological regression and feeling like I have no control over my thoughts and emotions. Please understand that it ends.

Something that has been very helpful for me has been Svaroopa Yoga, which is a restorative yoga that focuses on pain relief and emotional/psychological benefit. It can be difficult to find a Svaroopa instructor in your area, but there are many places that offer restorative yoga classes that provide similar benefits with different styles. It is incredibly grounding and essentially works in a way to naturally balance the same chemicals that are effected by the medication. The mind/body relationship is really fascinating and inspiring, and you should be able to find a good class for around 10 bucks.

In the meantime, I'm continuing to try to take my own advice and also hoping that the healthcare bill provides some relief to many of my friends (I'm an art student, and I have a lot of people close to me who unfortunately cannot afford these ridiculous premiums).

Feel good,
Jared

#18 MaureenV

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Posted 28 November 2009 - 12:40 AM

Hi Jared,


Great to hear that there ARE doctors who understand how difficult it is to get off this drug.



Unfortunately (for them AND us) the dosages provided by the drug company don't allow us to drop down in dosage at the same rate as our body is able to accommodate.


There are people who are able to come off Cymbalta rapidly without too many side effects. Given the number of google searches for 'Cymbalta withdrawal' compared with other anti-depressants,though, the evidence would tend to suggest that Cymbalta is the worst in this regard.

I did an incredibly slow wean from 30mg, which took a few months, and STILL suffered (admittedly mild) side effects each time i dropped a few mg. I did the very slow wean after finding the effects of trying to take 30mg every second day difficult to deal with.

You can be off the drug without doing these significant drops if you choose. You just need to buy clear gelatine capsules which enable you to divide the doses - you can open the capsules. Just make sure that whatever dose you DO take, you take inside a capsule, because although it's not essential, it prevents any damage to the beads before they reach your stomach, and as they're slow release beads, that bit's important.

Great to hear about your success with yoga. Unfortunately I'm not a yoga person ( I like fast moving things: motorbikes, bike riding, running) , but I think it's brilliant for relaxing, and would suggest it any day for those suffering panic attacks (not my reason for taking Cymbalta incidentally).


As an Australian getting great benefits from our system, I too hope that you all get the system YOU DESERVE in the US.

Once a new system has been in place for a while, you will see that, like most well off countries, BASIC health care is a RIGHT, just like education.


cheers, Maureen.



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