69 replies to this topic

[FiveNotions]

Well, I no longer need to struggle to describe what a panic attack feels like....this new "amusement" ride says/does it all....

http://www.dailymail...ens-public.html

Can you fathom why someone would seek out, and pay for, this experience?

[gail]

FiveNotions, actually no energy to post in the book forum. 3 months now.

 

In a dark at the moment, not actually feeling good, after 10 days of being better, now I am back in a dark place. That scares the shit out of me at times, but when reading that book Full Catastrophe....... makes me feel hopeful.

 

I got 3 books from Kabat Zinn, all of them very interesting. If I had to choose one it would be the Full Catastrophe one, he describes to a T the feeling of what I am living, anxiety and panic wise.

 

When not in crisis, It is actually easy enough to follow directions, just have to let the crisis have it's moment. I try to practice just the same, but with much impatience, and that is all right.

 

In that movie of yours, I want the second role...got to mention that at this moment, my mind, my brain is not in ideal condition for the role, or maybe it is.

[Wagtail]

FiveNotions, actually no energy to post in the book forum. 3 months now.
 
In a dark at the moment, not actually feeling good, after 10 days of being better, now I am back in a dark place. That scares the shit out of me at times, but when reading that book Full Catastrophe....... makes me feel hopeful.
 
I got 3 books from Kabat Zinn, all of them very interesting. If I had to choose one it would be the Full Catastrophe one, he describes to a T the feeling of what I am living, anxiety and panic wise.
 
When not in crisis, It is actually easy enough to follow directions, just have to let the crisis have it's moment. I try to practice just the same, but with much impatience, and that is all right.
 
In that movie of yours, I want the second role...got to mention that at this moment, my mind, my brain is not in ideal condition for the role, or maybe it is.

Gail, after 6 mnths & quite a few good days .. I have one foot in the dark @ the moment too ... As well as the discontinuation syndrome I have caught a chest & head cold .. I feel despondent & wondering if I will ever have a normal life again without antidepressants .. I didn't feel good when taking Cymbalta but @ least I was able to function most of the time . Now I have a few good days & then I can't leave the house for a week .
I am scared that I might be one of the few that don't actually make it to the other side ...:-(

[thismoment]

Wagtail

 

So sorry you're struggling.

 

Can you tell me what you are feeling? Are you depressed in the Major Depressive Disorder sense, or are you feeling 'blue' or 'down' or 'melancholy'  because of other uncomfortable discontinuation symptoms combined with the head & chest cold?

 

Statistics show that more than 2/3 of depressed patients will relapse in the first 6 months following discontinuation. It means their major depression returns, and they generally go back on antidepressants. Do you feel your current depression is of that category?

 

Is the up-and-down wave activity as you describe- one good day and 7 bad days where you can't leave the house? That is a tough ratio.

 

I wonder if fishinghat would comment, thanks.

[gail]

Gail, after 6 mnths & quite a few good days .. I have one foot in the dark @ the moment too ... As well as the discontinuation syndrome I have caught a chest & head cold .. I feel despondent & wondering if I will ever have a normal life again without antidepressants .. I didn't feel good when taking Cymbalta but @ least I was able to function most of the time . Now I have a few good days & then I can't leave the house for a week .
I am scared that I might be one of the few that don't actually make it to the other side ...:-(

Wagtail, just know what you mean.

 

I know that for myself, anti-depressant are not the answer. Never felt good on them or better. I am waiting for the 4 or 5 month mark to see what will turn up. And then, I will decide.

 

I remember that in 2004, I was on celexa for a year, no side effects. But if worst gets to worst, I would try them again. Seems paradoxal saying that ad does not work on me, but at least with this one, no side effects. And this one does not scare the shit out of me.

 

Have you read Fivenotions's article on withdrawal lasting up to a year? the lady mentions that after 6 months, she was feeling half normal, took a year to be back to her own self. This brings hope.

 

I am up at this hour with such a headache, a mentrual cycle that does not relent, yes at 61. 2 biopsies, all normal. I blame my mood half on that and half on discontinuation. Going back to bed, so fed up of all this, seems to me that this all what life is about, symptoms, discontinuation, menstrual cycle, God, is there something else we can think about? like the moon and the stars and the sun, sorry, I feel in the dumps at this moment.

[FiveNotions]

Oh wagtail and Gail.....hugs and love is what I want to give you....remember the Uncle Wiggly Stories from when we were little? Uncle wiggly was a rabbit with rheumatism....and his dear friend, Nurse Fuzzy Wuzzy, looked after him....both of you need a Nurse Fuzzy Wuzzy to take care of you!

Please, bot of you, take heart in the fact that you are indeed having good days....wagtail, you had your "top of the mountain" / real you experience recently.....and you said at that time you knew some hard days might follow, but at least you'd have the good to remember....

And Gail, you've just had 10 days in a row.....ten is a long string of good days....

You've both made huge progress, consistent recovery and growth.....just go back and read your earliest posts....I did...and I see the healing that has/is happening....

The bad days, mini relapses, are the downs that follow the ups....I have them consistently....like after my excitement about the library job last week....I went all out on doing what needed to be done...resume, etc etc....and I drained my gas tank....I didn't maintain my balance...fell off the bike...and banged myself up.....

Today I'm up and getting back on the bike to try again....because this time I'll be able to keep my balance and stay up and moving a bit longer....

Remember, recovery isn't a test, isn't a competition, isn't graded A to F.....the crappy will pass....the next good day is on it's way....go easy on yourselves...

[fishinghat]

Each person has to make the decision "how much can I take?" for themselves. We are so different. Wagtail, your improvements are sure slow. I guess it comes down to 'Are you still improving?' and 'How much more of the bad days can you handle'? Wagtail, if you feel like you are not improving anymore there are other options that may make a difference.

 

Supplements - Of which I am not an expert. Others would have to weight in on that.

Therapy - Where they teach you many techniques to control the symptoms. This can be a huge help.

Acupuncture, and I am sure others on this site can increase this list.

 

You have fought a great fight and gone a long ways from the dog days of just surviving. Is it time to make a change? Let us know if you have any questions or concerns and we will do everything we can to help you out.

[TryinginFL]

Wagtail and Gail - I feel so bad for you both FN and fh have posted such helpful advice!

I haven't thought of Uncle Wiggly and Nurse Fuzzy Wuzzy since I was about 8!

We all want only the best for you - my thoughts and prayers are with you.

Liz

[FiveNotions]

Have you found a new doc yet, wagtail, you'd mentioned I think that your current one is just a GP with not much anti/d experience?

Or maybe a naturopath?

[fishinghat]

Or maybe both! I know going to see a dr or therapist is stressful, especially with your symptoms but you have a secret weapon. US!!! See the dr/therapist or naturopath and get his advice. We have the people and resources on this site to help you weed through their recommendations and assist you in deciding if their advice is sound. Once again...You are not alone.

[TryinginFL]

I am out of "likes" but want to "like" FN and fh's posts!

[gail]

Oh FiveNotions, I needed to hear that. You know how it is with bad days, seems it's been there forever.

How do I go back to see previous posts of Moi. Sounds like Miss Peggy, Moi.

 

Liz, thanks for your compassion, yes, what I would do to be back at 4 and be in my mother's arm in those moments.

 

Speaking of gaz tank, I did really a good job at emptying it yesterday at work. Sorry FN for your falling off the bike.

 

Back on the bike, slowly, very slowly. We keep picking ourselves up time and time again.

For sure, there will be no stop anywhere when on our way to heaven..lol..

 

I can just imagine the few words I will have with The Great Boss up there, Ah well, have to keep the spirit.

 

I love you all, you are so kind.

[FiveNotions]

Oops...nope, I didn't really fall of the bike...that was metaphorical....a reference to when I was a kid....I haven't gotten on my new, current bike....first bad weather, then my friend in the nursing home most recently the job possibility...all took me away from trying out the new wheels... ;-)

Remember what our parents said to us when we borrowed the car....always leave some gas in the tank.... Hehehehe

[Xanazul]

Wagtail,

I’ve also gone through your posts and feel that the trend is 3 steps forward and one or may be two sometimes, back.

That is progress I believe, although I can understand that your hopelessness and how tired you must feel.

According to DSM-IV criteria for MDD diagnosis, the symptoms (at least five of them) have to be present for at least 15 days in a row, so I bet your not in a relapse.

This you wrote three days ago:

I could see the world through the eyes of my 3yo grandson ... I noticed the mild balmy weather,  I noticed the beautiful colored sky & trees & grass.
I laughed @ him laughing , I walked very fast , almost ran to keep up with him , I played on the playground equipment with him & loved every minute of it .

You were not depressed when you wrote that.

You will feel and write like this today, tomorrow, the day after tomorrow, or may be just now.

A I just was’t feeling too good to post that day and I own you this:

I wish you feel the best you can all the rest of your Un Birthdays of the year and take much care.

[TryinginFL]

FN - referring to your post of yesterday regarding that insane new ride at Busch Gardens...

 

I had seen that on the news and thought "you couldn't PAY me enough money to get on that thing".  I'd have a heart attack on the way down and wouldn't even get to spend the money

 

Yes, a true panic attack, indeed

[gail]

Xanazul, very interesting post to Wagtail, thank you.

 

FiveNotions, I understood what you meant by falling off your bike, at least, I am not so lost, or so I think.

 

How, again, do you go to ancient posts? I want to see the progress that has been made by Moi.

 

Few moments of inner peace today, love those.

[Wagtail]

Thank you everyone,
Thismoment , .. Depressed or depression ? ... I'm not sure ... The need to take Zanax on a regular basis scars me very much but it's the only way that I can stop feeling scared & anxious .
I have had some good days but even they come with a lot of effort , my feelings seem to be up & down all the time .

I was all full of determination a couple of months ago & tried very hard to exercise & stay positive .. It didn't take long to learn that for every day I pushed myself hard I would need to spend the following few days dragging myself around.
As you all know , on good days we can conquer the world & on bad days it feels like we are going to be like this forever .

Someone once said that we could allow one month of recovery for every year on Cymbalta ..so for me that would be approx 10 months I know I need to be patient & see how I am in 4 months time .
My fear is that in four months time I will be addicted to the Zanax .. I can already feel when it wears of & I get all panicky .. If only I could switch my mind off & stop thinking so much .
I am a perfectionist by nature & beat myself up when I can't get things done ... " I EXHAUST MYSELF ! " mentally ...
I over annalize things ..

I did get a referal to see a therepist ( pychologist ) & it's sitting on my desk ... I thought I would wait & see if I really needed it .
I have found a good naturopath but they are so expensive , I took our 16 yr old grandaughter to see her & the first visit was for one & a half hours & with two lots of supplements it cost me $240 .. Out of pocket expense .
I'm rambling now ....
I will take all your advice on board & sort through it all ....

Just reading through your replys has helped me feel a little stronger ..
Again thank you all for being here for me ..xxxxxxxxxxx

[thismoment]

Wagtail

 

I'm going to go out on a limb and speak for everyone- humour us, please see the therapist.

[fishinghat]

First of all don't fear the Xanax. Yes it can be addictive but the withdrawal is nothing compared to Cymbalta. I have come off of benzos before and it can be done slowly with little or no problems. Next, go for the therapist. When I had my nervous breakdown I was put on ....well let us just say a lot of meds. My therapist was super. She taught me a lot of skills that really helped me deal with the anxiety symptoms. Little tricks that really helped me cope. At the end of two years of therapy I was on half of the meds I started with. Don't underestimate a good therapist.

 

I can really identify with the perfectionist thing. Dot every I and cross every T. Priorities have changed for me and so has my attitude BUT it takes time and work to re-write the way you think. You also need to get some control of your life. Going like crazy when you feel good and paying for it the next few days is not the answer. I established a schedule for myself at the very beginning. I started out working 30 minutes and then take a 30 minute break. With time I learned which things were stressful for me and which things I could handle well. As I learned to address each of these stressors my work time slowly increased and my break time slowly reduced. Now there is times when things are out of your control but on normal days try to develop a reasonable schedule so you don't go crazy working one day and suffer the next.

[TryinginFL]

TM and fh, I agree - Wagtail you must take care of yourself!  You need to show yourself the kindness you were showing your 3 yr old grandson.  I, too, used to be a perfectionist, but what difference does it make in the entire scheme of things?  If you are feeling miserable, it makes no difference and perhaps you tend to think too much!  (I have to work at not doing this myself or I go bonkers)

 

Being able to talk to a trained therapist is so helpful - I have been seeing my psychologist for almost 5 yrs now and only see him once a month at this point, but don't want to give him up!  There is always something that comes up, it seems, and having him there is like a security blanket for me!

 

I send you love, best wishes, hugs and prayers,

Liz

 

P.S. I take Xanax too, but only when extreme anxiety sneaks up on me - and I don't worry about it!  If I need it, I take it  

[fishinghat]

Never have truer words been spoken TFL.  It is hard to turn the switch off in the brain.

[FiveNotions]

The wonderful therapist I had back in the 80s....when I was killing myself with round the clock lawyering/law school, taking care of my ailing parents long distance, working out an hour a day and drinking myself into alcoholism (a bottle of very fine wine a night)..... Told me to go right ahead and strive for perfection.... "to strive to be perfectly ..... mediocre"....

She saved my life with that one statement.... ;-)

[MyShell1979]

Hi all,

 

I just read a few posts and I see myself in a lot of you.  Or my situation at least.  I went on Cymbalta after my mom died and had been on it for over 8 years. I went off it, as I felt I wasn't dealing with life and didn't want to be on drugs forever!! When I went off it, I had severe nerve pain in a damaged arm, and decided to go on it again. And again, went off it again.  Had all the horrific side effects they don't tell you about.  Thought I was done and felt ok, sad, but ok.  I have been off it for over 4 months now and in the past 2 weeks, I wake up so anxious, I feel as if I am going to burst.  Only had anxiety problems back in 1986, saw a psychiatrist and had an open end prescription to Xanax.  Long story short, I ended up in rehab to get off of my addiction.  Was good after that, but now feel as if I am having anxiety again.  Nothing new to cause this.  I am sad, unmotivated, depressed, anxious, edgy, and would prefer to just stay in bed if I could, and do sometimes.  Any words of wisdom out there?  I feel scared feeling like this and just hating life and myself these days and feel bad for those around me.  Blessings to you all, Shell

[fishinghat]

MS1979, Welcome. I have an idea what may be causing this. There is a lot of research out there that the ssri, snri and benzos cause changes to the structures of our nerve cells and synapses. In the case of benzos the nerves take 6 months to a year to repair. The damage done by ssri/snri (like Cymbalta) is much more extensive than what the  benzos do. Just based on the people here on this site who have been through benzo hell (withdrawal) many of us believe it frequently takes 1 to 2 years for significant repair. No research has actually been done on this as of yet. Also to be considered is the fact that the ssri/snri are fat soluble and are stored in the liver and fat tissue. Once a person comes off the Cymbalta this stored Cymbalta can be slowly released into the blood stream and theoretically greatly extend the withdrawal symptoms, Detectable traces of Cymbalta have been found in patients blood 1 year after quitting the med.

[thismoment]

MS1979

 

I agree with what fishinghat said.

 

In addition, the return of anxiety may not be solely neurologically based; psychological causes of anxiety can go back decades. If you're not already seeing one, I'd advise seeing a psychologist who can help you reduce your anxiety with fewer benzos.

 

But in the end you have to do what you have to do to revive your quality of life- that's all that matters.

 

Please keep us posted.

[Wagtail]

MS 1979 welcome to our lounge room , sit down & make yourself comfortable ...

Your new besties will hold your hand & support you through your journey ... The combined knowledge & experience of our most admired members is priceless.
Trust them & listen to what they advise you to do ... They have already walked the walk & are well credited to " talk the talk "..

All of us who have & are , walking in their shoes ( well worn slippers ) have been very fortunate to have found this site & been supported gently through many days & nights of absolute terror .
I know that personally , I only made it because of their amazing compassion / empathy .

You are safe here !..:-)

[TryinginFL]

Welcome MS1979...

 

Wagtail told it all...     You are in good hands here and will find some wonderful, new cyber friends!  We hope that you will come here with your questions, little "positives" as they happen and just rant if you need to!

 

We are always here for you!

 

Again, welcome!

[MyShell1979]

Wow, I cannot thank you all who responded to my sob story.  I did look at a few books mentioned and ordered them.  Should be here within the week.  Looked up the 12 step info as well with the Emotions Anonymous.  Not sure if I will actually go to a meeting.  I had tried Alanon a couple times and did not feel connected.  It is hard for me to share, especially since I cry at everything.  I did call and finally was able to get an appt with a psychiatrist to go over meds and talk. But, could not get in till the end of next month.  I take Trazadone for sleeping as well, and would like to be off that as well. But, Yesterday, I was weak!!!! I couldn't stand the morning anxiety anymore, and thought I was going to have a heart attack and lose my mind.  Wished I could just run away and feel like I'm losing it.  I called my primary doctor and went in and he gave me a prescription of Effexor XR, which I started today.  He also gave me Xanax, which I took a 1/4 of a tablet this morning. I feel weak and like I am going to be on the path of bad meds again, but not sure what to do.  Are any of you on other meds? Are you responding affectively? I was not comfortable with the Xanax, so I took only a 1/4.  In 1986 I had gone to a psychiatrist who gave me an open end prescription for Xanax and I was addicted to them.  Started having seizures when I tried weening myself off them and ended up in detox for a week.  It was horrific.  I can't believe I am sharing this personal info on myself.  Really makes me sound weak and I am sorry.  Again, curious if anyone is on other meds with good outcome or am I headed down a bad and scary path again.  Thank you again for the love and support, xoxo Shell

[fishinghat]

MS1979. You should be aware that effexor is a close sousin to cymbalta. If you ever get addicted to a benzo again please let me know. There is a way of getting off the drug with little problems. But it does take some time.

[MyShell1979]

Fishinghat, Thank you for the info.  I was able to get off of Cymbalta, but now I am having the issues.  It was hell getting off but not as bad as these days.  Can I ask how you ween yourself off? Blessings...