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#61 fishinghat

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 12:11 PM

Kathyms, I am sure it is not thismoments intent to scare you but we need to be honest with people. Is it likely? No but it is possible. Does that mean the full withdrawal lasts that long? Thank God no. But Cymbalta is stored in liver and fat tissue and can take months to get rid of it. That is part of the reason  the last of the withdrawal can just drag on. One research indicated that only 7% of people have withdrawal of 6 months or more. So don't panic but be aware.


#62 thismoment

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 12:51 PM

kathyms3150

 

Of course my intent was not to scare you, therefore I apologize. 

 

But you need to know that withdrawal symptoms can be around for a long time, and often physicians give us a false sense of recovery time by telling us it just takes a few weeks.  

 

Please talk to some of the good people who have been off for some months, and are still struggling with symptoms. FiveNotions, Equuswoman, Wagtail, Xanazul, Clara, Xman, Gail, TryinginFL, Fishinghat. 

 

I've been off 22 months and I still have a couple of symptoms that persist. Fishinghat too.

 

This isn't to scare you Kathy, it's to prepare you.


#63 TryinginFL

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 01:25 PM

Kathy, I'm sorry to say that yes, some things appear again suddenly, and it is extremely frustrating when this happens.  I have been off the crap for over 5 months now and have had many, many good days in a row.  Starting yesterday, I felt the old depression starting again and it has taken a good hold on me at this point.  I have no explanation other than to say that it happens - I think everyone who has been where I am would agree - some symptom will seem to sneak up on you and pounce when you least expect it.  It has been so long since I have had any really bad days that I was completely taken off guard.  But here it is, again :angry:

 

Who was it that said "Cymbalta is the gift that keeps on giving..."  Think it was fishinghat or ThisMoment.  

 

I know that better days will come and perhaps, many of them again as before! :)  I hope this is only a minor setback.

 

Please don't be afraid...you will make it through just as we all have - just know that you may have a surprise or 2 along the way.

 

Hugs and Prayers,

Liz :hug:


#64 gail

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Posted 05 June 2014 - 02:51 PM

Hi Liz,

 

Yup, symptoms come back on and off. But they are less scary than they used to be. Just the same, it does shake us and reminds us of where we are coming from. Out of the blue, here comes moments of depression, of anxiety of nausea of anything to shake us.

 

And out of the blue, they leave. Never know what to expect, and of course, we think the worst. What if, what if?

 

I have periods where I can barely put one foot in front of another, so tired,and I am sure that I must be anemic. Or lacking something in my body. Blood tests came back today, all normal. I thought the worst.

You will feel better soon, today, tomorrow, who knows?

 

Kathy, yes, I have stopped 15 weeks ago. During that 15 weeks, there were moments that I was not sure that I would make it.

In the last 2 weeks, I am sure that I will. Still with moments of depression, getting shorter and shorter. Anxiety is under control 85% of the time.

 

I do think I will have to accept the fact that I will never be totally anxiety free. Mindfulness is helping me to transcend this moment by moment. The same applies to moments of depression, things that I am learning to live with, I keep in mind the famous phrase Thismoment used lately, resistance is futile

 

It is as it is, what's left to do when you cannot alter the condition or situation you are in? I know, easier said than done. But after months of suffering and wanting to run away from it,  I found that there is nowhere to hide, nowhere to go. Letting it be.

 

A famous phrase from a 6th century monk, YOU CANNOT ASK WHEN IT IS NOT THE TIME FOR THINGS THAT WILL COME IN THEIR OWN TIME. IT IS NEEDED OF YOU TO WAIT FOR THAT THING TO ADVANCE BY ITSELF.

 

I am learning lessons here.


#65 kathyms3150

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Posted 06 June 2014 - 10:34 AM

thismoment, thank you, I know your intent wasn't to scare me..  I understand it can take awhile for the symptoms to go away, but because my anxiety is so bad I panicked. The thought of it lasting for a long time is unbearable. There has to be something that can help lessen it besides the benzos. They help a little, but there's only so much I can take or I guess I could OD.  I want to get off this crap but the anxiety is holding me back.  I wonder if doing anything to try and get it out of my liver might help. I'm not into herbal things, but I read Milk Thistle and Dandelion Root can help detox the liver.

 

Thank to everyone else who replied. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Hugs to all.


#66 gail

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Posted 06 June 2014 - 10:57 AM

Hello Kathy,

 

Hydroxizine,(atarax) can help lower the anxiety. Prescription needed. Fishinghat has much info on this.

 

Benadryl caplets extra strenght, try 2. Dont plan to do anything if you take it, it relaxes you in a way no benzo does. That is my experience. Fast relief. Could hardly believe the relaxed state that I was in. I do not know, however if this can be taken often or not. Again Fishinghat can advise you on this.

 

That is all I can suggest for great anxiety. Wish you well, you can also search hydroxizine by entering this word in the top right of the forum

.


#67 fishinghat

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Posted 06 June 2014 - 11:36 AM

Hi Kathy. Gail is right on the hydroxyzine. It is non-habit forming and no withdrawal. It is rated as good for anxiety as  benzos. One thing to realize, hydroxyzine, benadryl and benzos are all capable of making you sleepy. Do not combine them without talking to yoour dr first. I prefer hydroxyzine over benzo because it is non-addictive with no withdrawal. It goes in effect in 30 to 45 minutes. It can be used as a "as needed" medicine for anxiety, usually 25 or 50 mg. Or it can be taken 4 times a day to battle constant anxiety. Because of its 'sleepiness" start at a low dose and work your way up based on how sleepy it makes you AND it can lower blood pressure although that usually goes a way after a couple weeks. In my case I am taking 50 mg four times per day for anxiety and coming of my ativan which I became addicted to. Think of it as a medicine swap. lol   Benadryl also makes you drowsy. I personally do not find it as effective on my anxiety as benzos or hydroxyzine but some do. In any case, which every one(s) you try start at a low dose and work up. One caution on benadryl.  It is famous for bad reactions with other medicine so check your compatability closely. The maximum dosage of benadryl is 25 to 50 mg every 4 to 6 hours and do not surpass 300 mg in a day. I am telling you if you take that dosage you will probably be out the whole day!!


#68 rasrob

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 01:09 AM

Hi Kathy. June 28, 2013 I came to this website and started asking how to get off of my 5 year Cymbalta for fibro. My final dosing was in August of 2013, but by June, I was on a 20 mg dosage. My doc said to quit cold turkey too, but my guts said, "That can't be right." That is how I found this community.

 

I see that some of those that carried me through the process are writing you also. I echo-take it slow and even take the same dosage when you need to as you decrease your way out.

 

It does take a while to stabilize after getting off, but listen to the advice of those that have done it. For me, I had job changes and the accommodations couldn't get into place, so fibro flared and I wiped out. But, I was determined not to get back on Cymbalta. I completely changed my eating, added supplements with a nutrionist guiding and have used meditation and acupuncture daily/weekly to get my through this time. Acupuncture also works for depression/anxiety.

 

As I have been healing, I find I am feeling more like myself than ever before. I cannot believe how Cymbalta masks the pain but also other emotions-like joy. I feel like I am experiencing the world and people more clearly too. Still, when I see docs-their first move is to throw more pills my way. My standard statement is, "I have found that for me the side effects do not outweigh the benefits. I wonder if I might try alternatives first."  Alternative or wholistic medicine may not work as fast, but works better for me.

 

So, it is worth it to keep taking a day at a time and slowly coming off. I am a teacher and will return in the fall with the accommodations in place this time.

 

Hang in there. You are not alone.


#69 fishinghat

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Posted 07 June 2014 - 08:16 AM

Hi Rasrob!!!! It is good to hear from you and really appreciated your update.May things just kep getting better for you!!


#70 ZappAlta

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 03:35 AM

thismoment,

Please don't say that the withdrawal could last for years. I'm having the worst panic attack of my life now.

How are you doing Kathyms?


#71 FiveNotions

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 05:49 AM

I just found an interesting online forum specifically for anxiety and panic sufferers and recovery....www.anxietyzone.com

Here's a post, for example, about using OTC motion sickness meds to reduce/control panic attacks...

http://www.anxietyzo...ic,89158.0.html

#72 gail

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 05:59 AM

Would like to hear from you Kathy, how are you doing?

 

A few suggestions were made, article of FN is a good one to read. Never heard about Bonine.

 

We care about you Kathy.


#73 kathyms3150

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 10:25 AM

Hi Gail,

Thanks for recommending the hydroxyzine. When I talk to my doctor I'll ask her about it. Same thing about the Benadryl.  I'm a little hesitant because my pharmacist recommended melatonin and my doctor said it was okay to try it. I cut the pill into a quarter and it made me so dizzy, I tried it twice so I know it was the melatonin. I've never afraid of taking medications before, but this experience with Cymbalta has changed the way I feel. 


#74 FiveNotions

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 10:28 AM

Melatonin, even a small dose, gave me nightmares....

#75 kathyms3150

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 10:32 AM

Hi fishinghat,

Thanks for sharing your experience with the hydroxyzine. Is that the same thing as Vistaril?  I think I was on that awhile ago but don't remember how it worked for me. It's good to know it's not habit forming or that it doesn't cause withdrawal. Yes, I've heard Benadryl can have bad reactions with other meds, so I think I'll forget about that. I wish I knew if the anxiety is a withdrawal symptom or just the anxiety I would have if I wasn't on meds.


#76 kathyms3150

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 10:39 AM

Hi rasrob,  I'm sorry to hear that you have fibro. I have a friend that has it and I know it's very painful. I'm tapering down the Cymbalta more slowly than I did before and finding it a bit easier. I'm at 50 mgs, down from 120. When I get down to 20 mgs I'm not sure what to do since that's the smallest dose it comes in. I wish they made it in tablet form so we could cut it.  I'm taking an herbal mixture for liver health. It has milk thistle in it which I read can help detox the liver. Not sure if it'll help, but it's worth a try.  Good luck and thanks for your support.


#77 kathyms3150

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 10:47 AM

Thanks for asking ZappAlta,

I'm down to 50 mgs and tapering down slowly. Like I said above I wish Cymbalta came in tablets instead of capsules. Not sure what to do when I get down to 20 mgs. I'm a little dizzy and my stomach is not great, but the anxiety is still the worst symptom. I do feel a little more depressed too. I sure wish I didn't need meds but I know I'm going to have to find another AD that helps. I'm on a low dose of Brintellix, but it's not enough to really be effective, especially with the withdrawal symptoms.


#78 kathyms3150

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 10:51 AM

Thanks FiveNotions, I'll check out the anxiety forum. Sorry you had nightmares on melatonin. I have a friend who's totally into natural remedies and herbs but even with those you never know how it's going to affect you.


#79 fishinghat

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 11:04 AM

Hi fishinghat,

Thanks for sharing your experience with the hydroxyzine. Is that the same thing as Vistaril?  I think I was on that awhile ago but don't remember how it worked for me. It's good to know it's not habit forming or that it doesn't cause withdrawal. Yes, I've heard Benadryl can have bad reactions with other meds, so I think I'll forget about that. I wish I knew if the anxiety is a withdrawal symptom or just the anxiety I would have if I wasn't on meds.

Hi Kathy. Yes hydroxyzine is the same thing as Vistaril.

 

As far as whether your anxiety is from withdrawal or not....well just time will tell. If it slowly fades with time probably a withdrawal issue. Like so many parts of this process it is all about patience.


#80 fishinghat

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 11:06 AM

Hi rasrob,  I'm sorry to hear that you have fibro. I have a friend that has it and I know it's very painful. I'm tapering down the Cymbalta more slowly than I did before and finding it a bit easier. I'm at 50 mgs, down from 120. When I get down to 20 mgs I'm not sure what to do since that's the smallest dose it comes in. I wish they made it in tablet form so we could cut it.  I'm taking an herbal mixture for liver health. It has milk thistle in it which I read can help detox the liver. Not sure if it'll help, but it's worth a try.  Good luck and thanks for your support.

 

Below 20 mg is easy with bead counting.

Bead counting, is where you open the cymbalta capsule each day and remove a few beads, usually 2 or 3. So the first day you remove 3 beads, the next day 6 beads, the next 9 beads etc. This provides for a slow steady withdrawal. If symptoms get to bad you just hold at that dosage for a while until you stabilize. Then start dropping again. Be aware that for most the last few beads give the worse withdrawal. Be prepared to slow down when you get to the very end. Now this is just an example. Some can only remove 1 bead a day and others 7 or 8 beads a day. You will have to play with it a little bit to find what works for you. This doesn't mean you won't have withdrawal but it will be lighter and you will have some control over it.


#81 kathyms3150

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 11:42 AM

Thanks again Gail. I can tell that you guys care and I care about you all too!


#82 kathyms3150

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Posted 10 June 2014 - 11:49 AM

Thanks for answering my question about the Vistaril fishinghat.

I'm hoping the anxiety is from the withdrawal and fades away but given the fact that I've had anxiety most of my life it's probably not going to go away. That means I'll have to stay on the benzos.

I was hoping I wouldn't have to do the bead counting, but when I get down to 20 mgs. I'll have to see how I'm feeling. There's just so many tiny beads I'm afraid I'll mess up the counting. Thanks again for being so helpful!


#83 ZappAlta

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 02:17 AM

Kathyms glad to see you post .  When you get to 20 mg continue to taper as I c/t at 20 and could have cut some of my w/d's had I found this board. Try not to fret about the 'What- If's'  . Turn on music -find  books on tape at the Library or Amazon>it really helps with distracting symptoms.


#84 ittybittysmitty

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 03:17 PM

Dear friends,

CAUTION: This may be confusing to your stressed out brain,

A week ago, my doc's plan was to switch from Celexa to Paxil because i was having a lot of mood swings BUT I had some GREAT days with no anxiety (the next few days after the appointment)...so i stayed on it..then I finally made the switch and the first day on Paxil was HELL...suicidial,anxiety through the roof, etc....so I saw him yesterday and he agreed to put me back on Celexa.

Today I made the switch and my mood is stable but I can't make decisions and the severe dizziness is back...my brain hates this so I'm taking two weeks off work so my brain doesn't explode. lol

...I see my doc in 2 weeks and we'll see if he feels I'm stable enough to start the bead counting...At least he's open to it!!! Thank God!!!

Anyone take a supplement or drug for the zaps? Have you heard of Neuro Endure Mini? TheRoadBack.org recommends it....

Peace to all...make it a great day despite everything...

Ittybittysmitty

#85 thismoment

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 03:34 PM

IBS

 

FN and FH know a lot about supplements, so hopefully they have something on zaps. 

 

The zaps don't last too long if you are reducing slowly- maybe a week. Keep your stress to a minimum and you just have to put in the time. Be patient.


#86 FiveNotions

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 03:47 PM

IBS,

I'm on my way out for dinner with a friend (now that's new behavior for me,)...so I'm posting just briefly....

I had mega zaps because I went cold turkey.....as long as you bead count I don't think you'll have them that bad....you'll likely have them, but they won't make you feel like your brain is totally sloshing around in your skull, etc.

I took a dose of omega 3 1200 mg. morning, noon and night.....for the first month or so I was taking a double dose...2400 mg three times a day....also, be sure to take a good b-complex....those did, I believe, help the zaps a lot....I also tried to just lie still, and not move my head any more than necessary...

Be sure you're also taking a multi vitamin and chelated magnesium.....

I'll check my notes to see if I took anything else for the zaps....as well as for other symptoms that arose....I tried to focus on supps and remedies for whichever symptom was the worst, or had newly appeared.....

More later...probable tomorrow morning.

#87 ittybittysmitty

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 04:29 PM

FN,

Thanks for your help...I think my brain is adjusting to the change from Paxil back to Celexa...but I'm thanking the good Lord that i'm fine mood wise..

I just took a daily dose of Omega 3 1170 mg...it has 400 EPA...

Have you heard of Neuro Endure Mini? Go to 'theroadback.org...the admin recommends it...it has amino acids in it...I'm scared to take it though with my meds.

where did you learn this stuff? Thanks for being a tree of knowledge. LOL. I appreciate you!!

#88 fishinghat

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Posted 12 June 2014 - 05:29 PM

I have never heard of that supplement but these days there are so many supplements.

 

I think this the indecisiveness, zaps and dizziness will (as TM said) fade soon. One week or two tops. I am really glad you are off the paxil. I didn't like the reaction you had to it so quickly. I think the dr and you made a good call to stay on the Celexa.


#89 ittybittysmitty

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 12:47 PM

I'm really upset because my dizziness is so bad driving would be too dangerous.

I had to cancel two social engagements today and cancelled both...I'm so angry I could scream!!!!!!

Anyone else unable to drive due to zaps/dizziness?

Thanks in advance for your support...I'm trying not to let it ruin my day...

#90 FiveNotions

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Posted 17 June 2014 - 01:03 PM

Yep, I know that dizziness, IBS.....I don't have a car, but if I did, I never could have driven....much less even walk far enuf to get into it! I had dizziness and vertigo so bad for a few weeks that I had to crawl to the bathroom and the refrigerator....we have a small grocery store in my building, and when I finally felt like I could try venturing out and down the hall to it, I still had to walk close to the wall so I could lean against it or just touch it in order to keep my balance.....

You definitely did the right thing to cancel the social engagements....just think of it as rescheduling or postponing...this isn't a permanent symptom, it passes, and you'll be able to reconnect with friends socially, I assure you....do you know these folks well enuf to explain what you're dealing with?

And if you don't feel comfortable telling people the full details, just say that you're dealing with some serious CNS central nervous system issues....I've learned that people accept that answer, and are immediately sympathetic....they think to themselves it must be something like MS or Parkinson's, and they back right off and don't pry....I call it my "Michael j Fox" defense....I've mentioned it elsewhere here, so you may already have seen it.....

Also, yes, anger at all this is perfectly appropriate....it's a good, healthy sign that you're healing and beginning to "wake up".... vent here all you want and need....I also pounded a pillow into total submission on several occasions! ;-)

Take the time you would have been socializing to rest and be gentle to yourself....

Are you taking your omega 3 in good size doses at each meal?



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