59 replies to this topic

[chrissyl]

I will be staying on the lamictal and mirtazapine. And my doctor said she would prescribe Prozac if necessary.  She said to expect a pretty rough time for about 2 weeks.  She went over quite a few of the symptoms ya'll talk about.  I'm thinking if it is too bad I could maybe talk to her about going to the bead counting.  I did read the FDA statement.  I have to say I was a little frightened about the things she told me I might experience because it sounded so much like the life I had before the Cymbalta. I can't lie. Taking Cymbalta along with the lamictal and mirtazapine turn my life around 180*. People actually told me how much they liked being around me after adding it to my regime. I was in a very dark place, a downward spiral with not light whatsoever.   It actually help me to totally change my outlook on things and learn to handle life.  But my psychiatrist said she feels it has done it's job after 4 years and it is time to get off it. I was a little apprehensive after what she told me I might experience. But I have to admit reading up on the withdrawal has scared the hell out of me.

[fishinghat]

I am not going to lie to you Chryssyl, it is tough.  A couple of things to remember. If the withdrawal gets too bad stay at that level until you stabilize and feel like dropping some more. And always rememeber it is the withdrawal directing your thinking. You must take it slow and be patient.

 

The prozac is also a good idea BUT it takes 6 to 8 weeks to build up in your body. It is not a fast fix.

A better choice would be a light benzo like valium or xanax on a as needed basis. Also many drs prescribe a stronger benzo called Ativan (generic is called lorazepam). The Ativan works very well but is a lot more addictive.

[FiveNotions]

Chrissy, how wonderful! And yours is the very first doc I remember anyone here telling anyone that it was time to get off! And she carefully walked you through the difficulties of withdrawal! Wow!

I need to make one, clear and strong, objection to what she suggested for your weaning plan.

Dropping from 60 to 30 mg is too fast and steep a drop. It will actually bring on the hard withdrawal symptoms. Others here will back me up on this. Your doc, while better than most, still doesn't fully understand what this drug is like to get off.....if all docs had experienced it, their advice would be different!

You need to stay at the 60 mg, and start bead counting immediately! As Fishinghat say, you'll still experience withdrawal, but it will be more moderate and you'll have some control over it.....at any point where the symptoms start to feel unmanageable, you can just go up a bead or two, wait to stabilize, and then resume bead counting.

Please contact your doctor and tell her this is what you want, need, to do. Since she's already on the right track for how to get off, maybe tell her about this forum, the experienced people on it, and even give her the website address and tell her to read just a few of the comments.

I'm just thrilled that you've already got a good basic plan, and have read up on this forum. Get back to us as soon as you've spoken with your doc, and we'll help you take it from there!

[thismoment]

chrissyl

 

Here is the best Eli Lilly has to offer those who wish to withdraw from Cymbalta:

 

"A gradual reduction in the dose rather than abrupt cessation is recommended whenever possible. If intolerable symptoms occur following a decrease in the dose or upon discontinuation of treatment, then resuming the previously prescribed dose may be considered."   Eli Lilly

[chrissyl]

Have not been able to talk to the doctor yet.  I took 60 mg Monday night.  Last night I took 30mg.  If I go with the bead counting do I go back to the 60 and start from there or go down from the 30? I just have 6-30 mg left.  I don't know what to do but I do know all this reading and indecision is stressing me out.  I hate the thought of the more severe symptoms but I'm leaning toward the 30mg for the next 6 days and just getting it over with it.  I know I will have a strong support system between here, my husband, my sons, my sister and my nephew's girlfriend who is an RN. I also know that I am the type of person who can stick with what I have to do until it's done. I just need to make a decision and go with it. I think I will talk seriously with those people and make my decision before my next dose.  

[thismoment]

chrissyl

 

I totally see the appeal of keeping it simple and tackling it straight-on; many people have done this with success. There is no right or wrong strategy, and it looks like you've chosen a route; perhaps that's half the battle. I will add that I bead-counted over 42 days and found it very rough, and if I had to do it again I would bead-count over 90 or 100 days.

 

You have a strong support system in place, and you are determined! Cold turkey ain't for the faint-of-heart, but many people have succeeded before you.

 

If there's anything we can do please advise. Also post your progress, and with the experience you'll be gaining, soon you will be able to help others here!

 

Best wishes!

[fishinghat]

I would strongly suggest going back to 60 mg and bead count from there.....BUT it sounds like you don't have enough medicine left for bead counting.

 

Two questions for you;

Can you get a refill?

and are you taking the generic or Cymbalta?

[chrissyl]

I've cut back from the 60 mg to 2 nights of the 30 mg.  So far I notice nothing unusual. I was on generic. Will that make a difference?  I'm determined to get this over with as quickly as possible.  My support system is in place and I have people checking on me.  My husband wants to take time off work but I told him it is not necessary now.  My son asked if he needs to come sit with me when his dad is at work.   He'll take vacation. Not necessary at this time. I'm pretty independent and like to take care of myself as much as possible.  My parents live next door.  I am luckier than a lot of people who have kicked this cold turkey.  I am retired and I have no children at home to care for. (Only my Boston Terrier and he will just have to lie quietly with me when necessary.) No trouble sleeping with the decrease in meds.  I have in the past skipped a couple of doses and only noticed if I skip 2 in a row I get a little weepy. I'm am determined not to let this beat me down. I will succeed.

[Limbo]

Hey All. I just wanted to introduce myself, I've read a lot of posts so I am starting to see some personalities shine. I am amazed at how long some of your have been on here, supporting the newbies like us. It's pretty amazing as you get the same questions quite often. 

I didn't know where to post my first post, so i chose this one. I am also just weaning off cymbalta. I've had depression for years but the last five months is the first time I tried anit-depressants. I'm not sure what to think. I think it helped, made me feel a little more heart for the things I loved as a child. I am afraid that now I might be saying goodbye to that child-heart after deciding to come off cymbalta. I am getting tired of the relentless nightmares and nightsweats. I don't know where to turn next - I meditate, control my drinking, and still, the depression comes.

 

Coming off Cymbalta this past monday gave me my first bad weekend. I really wanted to die for about an hour, it seemed the sweetest escape. What a terrifying feeling, although at least it passed within a couple of hours, after-which, it was more tolerable.

 

I did the same as so many here, I went from 60mg to 30mg one day, then 60 to 58mg the next, then back to 60mg-30. It didn't' help. So I'm following the majority of everyone's advice, slow bead counting with consistency.

 

That's all I have to say, mainly, I wanted to say hello to everyone, I share a lot in common with you, although we've never met! I'll likely be needing someone to message if anyone resonates with this message! I'll make sure I check in if anyone needs someone to talk to too.

[chrissyl]

I haven't been commenting in a few days, reading but no comments.  I kind of got the feeling I was on the outside with my determination to quit cold turkey against some advisement here.  Tonight will be my last 30 mg after going from 60 mg to 30 mg for a week. Didn't really have any big withdrawal symptoms, a few dull headaches and slight queasy stomach after eating or drinking and more aware that I am having dreams, although I can only remember one that was upsetting.  I'm trying to make sure not to let these symptoms alter my life in any way. I'm trying to keep extra busy doing the things I like to do. And the World Cup could not have come at a better time for me. Praying my experiences to this point mean I am one of the rare lucky ones and will get through this with minimal symptoms.  But I have prepared myself as well as anyone can be for what I may experience in the weeks to come.  Awesome and caring people ready to help me get through this, all the supplements advised here. I'm ready to go for it. 

[chrissyl]

What's a warning point?

[thismoment]

chrissyl

 

You're not on the outside at all: Most people quit cold turkey, and according to the data, most people don't have problems coming off Cymbalta. It's good to hear you're doing well with the withdrawal.

 

Best wishes!

[fishinghat]

Limbo

Sounds like a good plan.

 

Chryssl

Safe journey and keep us posted.

[ShadyLady]

Thank God, I found this forum!! I am somewhere in 14 days of withdrawal off this toxic crap! At this moment, I only want to say a huge,
THANK YOU to Dmiahawk, This moment & FineNotions for saving me today with laughter so hard, I was bent over & crying tears of joy at the same time! I had no idea anyone could possibly be as insane as me from this dope!! I do hope this is not viewed as inappropriate, as this is serious stuff!
I believe I have found myself a home here on my way back from nowhere! I am no rookie to Cymbalta. Also, I am old now, 58, and do hope there is some peace for the last leg of the journey....thank you all, again, for the "butter, sheets, online shopping, taller, slimmer drinking & honest comments you have shared!

[fishinghat]

Welcome home CymSik. I hope all goes well with you.

[ShadyLady]

Thank you, fishing hat! I am @ 15mg and it is hell, even with the high EPA Omegas for the brain zaps! There is something awful that happens below 30mgs...I am keeping the faith & the thread of sanity, at this moment(!), now that I found this site...

[thismoment]

CymSik

 

Welcome! Many of us have paddled this swamp, and we will gladly guide you through to the other side should you require directions!

[tria]

Limbo and Cymsik - Welcome!  I am new here as well. It took me a while before I posted but so glad I finally did! I've had that same "wanting to die" feeling. I know I don't truly want to die, but that feeling is horrible.  Sometimes, I'll actually go back and forth several times in the course of a day - feeling like I want to die then being terrified that I am going to die.  It would be comical if it didn't make me feel so awful!  This site and the people here are wonderful, although since I started posting I'm not getting much else done haha...... I have a limited amount of energy, and I should be paying bills right now!

[TryinginFL]

Welcome, Tria, Limbo and Cymsik...

 

So happy you have found us all...  You now have a new group of wonderful, caring, supportive and knowledgeable cyber friends!  We are all here to support and help you in any way that we can - please feel free to post with anything - how you are feeling, questions or just vent if you need to!  We have all done it and you are safe here

 

Again, welcome!

[FiveNotions]

Hi Cymsik and Limbo! I'm happy you found us.....I'm now in my 7th month off the poison, and I never would have made it if I hadn't found this place....the wonderful folks here helped me every step of the way, and a couple of time kept me from throwing in the towel and going back on the poison!

Many here have experienced the "it gets worse at the lower doses" misery....I wouldn't know, however, because I quit cold turkey, and caused myself to have a hard withdrawal straight through the first 6 weeks or so...duh.... ;-)

[FiveNotions]

Tria and Chrissyl, I think/hope I've welcomed you here already...if not, consider yourself welcomed! (I'm kinda spacey right now, had a busy day working to fix some of the personal life messes I made while on crapalta...that I was oblivious to at the time, and only just now am discovering...aaargh)

 

Chrissyl, I have no idea what a warning point is...I've never gotten one....anyone else here know? If not, I'll ask the site administrator....

[TryinginFL]

And I don't think I've welcomed Chrissyl - Welcome!  I agree with FN - short term memory still not entirely back!

 

And no - I don't know what a warning point is, either...

[Limbo]

Thank you everyone! 

Now that I have evened out my dosage, I feel normal again with having come down about 47 beads from however many are in the 60mg dosage (230+?). I admit, after the first drop, where I halved my dosage from 60mg to 30mg and went into crying fits with a strong desire to just give up, I am afraid. They say that you often feel you are relapsing into depression when you lower your dose, but it's just withdrawl. I must be feeling that. I suddenly feel stable and normal again and wonder if its working more than I thought it was. It seems like such a mind game... 

[Limbo]

So my question is for those who are off for a while - did you relapse relatively quickly after?

[FiveNotions]

Hi Limbo, I haven't had what I'd call a depression relapse....I've had a few mild relapses in the sense of mild return of physical symptoms when I let myself overdo or get overtired....mostly really achy body feelings, and optic neuritis....but those pass rapidly with just getting rest and chilling out the activity level.....

What I've had since the first week in June is a return of some serious anxiety....it first hit when I felt suddenly overwhelmed with returning memory and discovering the horrid life messes I'd caused myself while on the poison...didn't file taxes for four years, spent thousands doing weird online shopping, etc. add the fact that I'm running out of savings to live on....

I view that as situational, not related to a cymbalta relapse....

As I read your post above, am I correct that you're now back to being stable at z30 mg...having dropped from 60 by bead counting over a period of time?

Fishinghat, TM and others all point out that withdrawal seems to get harder at the lower doses for many of us.....I'll have to let them expand on that, cuz I did the whole thing the hard way by quitting cold turkey.....

My one thought is that you might want to just hang at 30 mg for a while...days, a week or two, even a month, before going back to bead counting....and, you might want to consider dropping fewer beads, even just one, and do so just every other or every few days.....

The goal here, obviously, is to get off the poison, but it's not a race....giving your body and brain lots of time to adjust as you decrease is what's important!

And, a huge Bravo! for how far you've come!

[fishinghat]

Well said FiveNotions. I couldn't have put it any better. Slow wins the race.

[Limbo]

Thank you for this reminder. Sometimes I want to rush to get off in the summer time (i'm in Canada) so that I don't get hit by the winter blues and withdrawl at the same time, but I don't want to lose the good feelings for that cause.

FiveNotions, I am surprised and saddened to hear how Cymbalta affected you, I noticed myself that I am more impulsive for purchasing, but it's not much more than before. It's scary to think that this drug really changed you in a negative way. I'm unsure it's done much other than cause me to feel a little more pleasant sometimes and maybe have a few panic attacks that are more intense (but pass much more quickly)...

[thismoment]

Hi Limbo

 

You said, "It seems like such a mind game. . ." and you also mentioned 'relapse'.

 

There is no way to comprehend what is happening during withdrawal and discontinuation, and trying to figure it out always ends up on the negative. Therefore it's best to avoid self-analysis during withdrawal and discontinuation and simply focus of staying healthy and avoiding stress.

 

There is no way to know if a symptom is part of withdrawal or if it's the emergence of a totally new condition. But it's almost always a product of withdrawal. That includes depression. It's common to encounter anxiety during withdrawal, and it needs to be addressed with a benzodiazepine or similar.

 

You kind of have to hunker down for 5 or 6 months until the symptoms blow over. Otherwise you could find yourself being prescribed medications (like another SSRI) to deal with symptoms that are most likely associated with discontinuation. 

 

Best wishes on your withdrawal; keep us posted.

[Limbo]

Hi This Moment,

Hm. you make sense. Maybe simply saying to myself "there is no way to comprehend this" is good enough for right now. I over self-analyze anyhow, so it's a bad habit of mine.  It's hard to leave the comfort of what's known when I don't have overly negative side affects- but it's not worth staying on when I likely don't need it anymore (my major stressors are gone and the storm is over).

 

Once you came off anit-depressants and the symptoms blew over, was it a positive change? What did you notice within yourself after it was over?

[thismoment]

Limbo

 

I was on Cymbalta for two years, and the first year provided worthwhile (though deadening) relief- I basically wanted to escape the problems I believed were causing my depression. Into the second year I escaped everything- bad and good; I turned into a zombie (not uncommon with Cymbalta) and my emotions flat-lined. I cared about nothing and no one, not even myself. I used to be a musician and a writer (avocations) before Cymbalta, and all that just went away. Finally, the thought slowly emerged within my brain, "I'm dead!" And so, it was withdraw or die- I vowed to live with whatever I could salvage.

 

During withdrawal my emotions returned and the colour returned to my life; I was able to re-connect with those I had loved before Cymbalta, and found I could love them again. It was a re-birth! Now after nearly two years Cymbalta-free I can write again, and my musical timing and tonal centre have returned. So, to answer your question, after it was over I noticed that I was alive again!

 

It's important to acknowledge that antidepressants create changes within the brain are physical, and during withdrawal or discontinuation, the brain has to make other physical alterations as it scrambles to establish equilibrium. 

 

When I said there's no way to comprehend what's happening during withdrawal, I meant that withdrawal symptoms are part of the trial-and-error re-wiring scramble your brain is doing to survive and become functional again. And it self-repairs remarkably well; it borrows, re-routes, shares, and sometimes it eliminates things and sometimes it creates totally new physical, emotional, and cognitive aberrations. Therefore most symptoms go away after some months, but often symptoms remain for an extended stay; some remain for life.

 

It's a crap shoot. But even with the few remaining symptoms I still have after 23 months off, I am totally happy.  I think that even if I had been given Informed Consent before going on the drug, I would have signed the papers.