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You Might Have Got It Wrong Then, Pharma & Doctors? [Serotonin Not Found To Be A Major Player In Depression]


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#1 BelaLugosisDad

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 11:33 AM

http://www.medicalne...ases/281645.php


#2 thismoment

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 12:21 PM

BLD

 

Interesting article!

 

"(the researchers) developed. . . mice that lacked the ability to produce serotonin in their brains. The scientists ran a battery of behavioral tests. Interestingly, the mice were compulsive and extremely aggressive, but didn't show signs of depression-like symptoms." 

 

Maybe this is the C-Rage we get after a short time off Cymbalta because we are surely serotonin-deficient at that time. So here's a thought: try 5-HTP for C-Rage.


#3 fishinghat

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 12:46 PM

You know that is a good thought TM. I think you may be on to something. But I think that one should be researched first just in case the effects are not what is expected.


#4 thismoment

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 01:58 PM

FH

 

Good point.

 

We know there are rage tragedies associated with some (perhaps a lot of) SS/SNRI withdrawal violence, so serotonin-deficiency fits there too. Of course there is always the issue of appropriate dosage with something like 5-HTP, and perhaps serotonin levels ought to be monitored during the withdrawal phase.

 

After some months, hopefully the normal functioning serotonin-production/management system would be back on stream. The 5-HTP would have to be managed and weaned so as not to foster dysfunction within the body's system. (Another can of worms is being opened to help re-pack the first can of worms). 


#5 brzghoff

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 02:11 PM

 

rage and dysphoria are classic symptoms of hypo mania as it cycles back to depression


#6 BelaLugosisDad

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 02:26 PM

You know that is a good thought TM. I think you may be on to something. But I think that one should be researched first just in case the effects are not what is expected.

 

YI just calculated there are just over 127 times the number of members of this forum than participants in Eli Lilly's pre marketing trials of this drug. 

 

Anyone want to crunch the maths of SEs, without the bias that we are not here because we enjoyed Cymbalta?


#7 thismoment

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 03:15 PM

Student, 19, in Trial of New Antidepressant Commits Suicide
By GARDINER HARRIS
Published: February 12, 2004

A 19-year-old college student who had shown no outward signs of depression killed herself over the weekend at an Eli Lilly & Company laboratory in Indianapolis where she had been participating in a company drug trial for an experimental antidepressant.

The student, Traci Johnson (she was 19), was one of 25 healthy patients at an Eli Lilly clinic who were being given larger than therapeutic doses of duloxetine, which will be known as Cymbalta if it is introduced as an antidepressant. Four days before her death, Ms. Johnson was taken off Cymbalta and given a placebo.

While Eli Lilly asserted that it had properly screened Ms. Johnson before the study started to ensure that she was healthy and had no mental problems, her death is being used by critics of a popular class of antidepressants to bolster their case that the widely used drugs carry the risk of suicidal tendencies for a small number of people, particularly young people.

Four other patients who were given the drug during earlier trials also committed suicide, the company said. The drug is being tested not only as an antidepressant but also as a possible treatment for stress urinary incontinence.

………………………………………………………………………..

 

Wow! 5 suicides just during the drug trials!

 

Here's more from the AntidepressantsFacts.com archive.

http://www.antidepre...ne-cymbalta.htm

 

 

 

Traci-Johnson.jpg

 
Traci Johnson died February 7, 2004.

#8 gail

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 05:34 PM

Ah! The joys of this c.

In my 60 years of life, never thought about suicide, never.

The thought crossed my mind three times while on and while withdrawal.

Scared the shit out of me.

I have no doubt about this reality.

Rats may not have diagnosed depressed, but I think that rage, compulsivity, are related to depression.

And I believe that, in our case of discontinuation, depression expresses itself in different ways.

After a while, we move on. Discontinuation cannot go on forever!

#9 thismoment

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Posted 29 August 2014 - 07:54 PM

Gail

 

Excellent points! I agree with everything you said.

 

I've often said that discontinuation is like a broken heart-- it ends when you stop thinking about it. Discontinuation could be our 'normal' status for all of the time we have remaining in our lives following withdrawal, but it really doesn't matter. The symptoms simply become smaller and fewer-and-farther between. If I don't know it's there, then it's gone.

 

If this is what it is, then we simply must accept it to carry on.


#10 Tinker

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Posted 30 August 2014 - 08:54 AM

5 suicides!! I wonder what the total population was? Surely 5 suicides would be looked as more than coincidental?

#11 thismoment

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Posted 30 August 2014 - 09:00 AM

I tried to find that number, but was unable to get it. A couple of thousand perhaps? Traci Johnson was not depressed upon entering the program which was to help pay her university fees. There is some question whether her informed consent included the previous 4 suicides, though.


#12 FiveNotions

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Posted 30 August 2014 - 11:59 AM

YI just calculated there are just over 127 times the number of members of this forum than participants in Eli Lilly's pre marketing trials of this drug. 
 
Anyone want to crunch the maths of SEs, without the bias that we are not here because we enjoyed Cymbalta?


BLG, that's an awesome idea/suggestion ... I just responded to an article FH posted that we needed to send it to Knox Ricksen in case they didn't know about it ...

I think this idea needs to be shared with them as well ... may I have your permission to do so?

#13 FiveNotions

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Posted 30 August 2014 - 12:05 PM

TM, it was the death of Traci, and the legal action taken by her parents, that got the ball rolling to take Cymbalta off the market ... actually, it was those first "Cymbalta martyrs" and all the ones who have died since then .... our suffering is massive, but nothing compared to being driven to suicide ... and, as we know, many of us here have been driven right to the brink ....

this shit has got to be stopped ...



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