1191 replies to this topic

[Mxpro32]

The stress response is crazy though. I had a customer upset about something minor, but my stress response was on par with getting sued or foreclosed on. Unbelievable. I'm getting better at seeing it for what it is though. Still takes forever for my body to come down from it. At least it didn't ruin my mood.

[frog]

FH and IUN does the stress response eventually settle down again to appropriate levels?

 

Mxpro I feel like your recovery is farther along than mine, but similar to you I feel like my physical response to even the slightest errant anxious thought is way overblown. Combined with the fact that it's been a pretty traumatic 3 months, even very small things like say knowing my husband won't be home when I get home, can get my heart rate going. I broke down a bit last night worrying if I will ever stop feeling so triggered by such trivial things. 

[fishinghat]

Eventually yes. It has been my observation that after being off for 6 to 8 months the anxiety starts to drop significantly and fo the next 6 to 8 months after that you are very sensitive to stressful events.  That too fades away. This is an exercise in great patience.

[frog]

That's a long time for sure but it is a huge relief that it's not permanent

[Polly38]

Mxpro and Frog. I know exactly what you mean about the stress response and we have absolutely no control over it.

I am managing to go to work and try to sit with it in the hope that it will go soon🙏. My anxiety is manifesting itself as the shortness of breath so I am doing breathing exercises and meditation. I hope to God that it doesn't last 6-8 months

Mxpro- how far into the journey are you please? Are you off it completely?

Praying for us all to get through this quickly!

Polly

[Mxpro32]

I'm almost 4 months completely off

[Polly38]

Thanks for your reply. Mxpro.

Do you feel like things are getting better week by week? I have been completely off for nearly 9 weeks. My symptoms are random sweating and shortness of breath. My ears are also constantly blocked, which sometimes makes me feel off balance.

[invalidusername]

During my withdrawal, I got stressed when a loud car when passed my flat... or when the door buzzer went... oh my! The stress tolerance was horrible. A year later and I can tolerate building noise, 10 hour work days and looking after a mentally ill wife.. but I have to be real careful. This is a lot for a "normal" person to take on. It only took a customer to threaten to take me to court and that tipped the balance and I have had some nasty moments this week - but then again, I have bee over doing it.

 

Remember that once we have have had stress intolerance, it never really disappears, it lays dormant until triggered. We always have to be on guard, but the longer you do it, the more natural it comes.

[Mxpro32]

Thanks for your reply. Mxpro.

Do you feel like things are getting better week by week? I have been completely off for nearly 9 weeks. My symptoms are random sweating and shortness of breath. My ears are also constantly blocked, which sometimes makes me feel off balance.

Oh, it’s definitely getting better.  My sleep has not improved at all yet unfortunately.  Still waking up with a shock 1-3 times a night without exception since about 3 weeks after totally being off.  I haven’t had a deep despair totally depressed day in a while.  Meditation, surrender, and acceptance seems to be helping that.  Stress response still hasn’t let me really help out in the shop much. Just being out there makes me really anxious.  Every email or phone call sets me off. Definitely improving though.

[Mxpro32]

I have been exercising daily for a few weeks now. I either jog for 20-30 minutes or ride my bike with trailer for 45 minutes to pick up my kids from school. Earlier in withdrawal exercise would wipe me out but lately it helps. My adrenaline was always high then. Yesterday, I had my first high adrenaline day in s while, and my bike ride wiped me out and made me depressed. Seems like a connection. The adrenaline days feel different than just anxious days.

[Mxpro32]

I've also noticed I'm constipated on the really depressed days

[invalidusername]

Sounds like you are getting to grip with things - the more you can keep the status quo of the ordinary life, the sooner it will return.

 

I am still having the stress issues from the start of the week, but unfortunately I am not at a point where I can just down tools and take days off. There are still things left to be done, and I too am having the same issue for the first half of the day where if the phone goes, or the email comes in, it send a wave of stress through me. I feel that the next thing will be the one to push me over the edge, but I don't know what that would entail - I just know if won't be good. The only thing that springs to mind is me sitting in a padded cell in a straight jacket where my brain has just given up completely. It does worry me that one day it will just rebel and do just that!!

[Mxpro32]

Sounds like you are getting to grip with things - the more you can keep the status quo of the ordinary life, the sooner it will return.

I am still having the stress issues from the start of the week, but unfortunately I am not at a point where I can just down tools and take days off. There are still things left to be done, and I too am having the same issue for the first half of the day where if the phone goes, or the email comes in, it send a wave of stress through me. I feel that the next thing will be the one to push me over the edge, but I don't know what that would entail - I just know if won't be good. The only thing that springs to mind is me sitting in a padded cell in a straight jacket where my brain has just given up completely. It does worry me that one day it will just rebel and do just that!!

Lol. It does seem like it would be really bad, but realistically it would just be extremely uncomfortable. Is it just me, or does a padded room sound nice at times?

[Mxpro32]

The status quo of doing my job in the shop really gives me anxiety, so I haven't been working much. I have wondered if it is better to push through and keep my work routine trying to cope with the anxiety, or if the stress overload is counterproductive?

[invalidusername]

That's what I thought - and that is when I overdid it....

[Mxpro32]

Ya, it kinda seems like the anxiety isn't conducive to healing

[fishinghat]

All good points. Be kind to yourself.

[Mxpro32]

Man. Exercise made me depressed again today. I felt pretty good (at least not bad) and now I'm pretty depressed after my bike ride. It's nice when exercise helps. It's weird how sometimes it doesn't now

[fishinghat]

The trick is low impact light exercise only until you get back on your feet.

[Mxpro32]

Yeah, I may have to back off for a while. Intense exercise was helping, but now sometimes it makes things worse. It's frustrating that pushing myself in any way results in anxiety and depression. Big picture I guess. Im just getting impatient. Luckily my guys are handling the business fine and I don't need to be out there. Now if I can quit beating myself about it.

[Mxpro32]

I've switched from Xanax to clonazepam. I wonder if that has anything to do with it? I'm sleeping from 12 to 5 now, which is a little better.

[fishinghat]

Clonazepam is considered the most effective benzo for anxiety, it is also considered the most addictive benzo with the worst withdrawal. What dose are you on?

[Mxpro32]

1mg.

[Mxpro32]

I thought I read somewhere that clonazepam is less addictive with less severe withdrawals because of the longer half life?

[invalidusername]

Yeah, I may have to back off for a while. Intense exercise was helping, but now sometimes it makes things worse. It's frustrating that pushing myself in any way results in anxiety and depression. Big picture I guess. Im just getting impatient. Luckily my guys are handling the business fine and I don't need to be out there. Now if I can quit beating myself about it.

 

This has been of discussion amongst a number of members, and the overall opinion (as Hat has suggested) is that light exercise will be the way to play it safe. Intense might seem like a good idea to burn off the excess adrenaline, but remember your body produces an amount consistent with what is used. 

 

So our point here being, give yourself enough to be of benefit, but not so much as to play around with the chemicals that are trying to balance themselves at the same time..

 

Make sense??

[fishinghat]

One mg once a day is not bad.

 

I will get back with you guys tomorrow about the addictiveness/withdrawal.

[invalidusername]

Sorry - didn't see that part that Hat mentioned. But he would be the right dude for that gig.

[fishinghat]

https://www.cymbalta...ge-8#entry90091
Mxpro - I thought I read somewhere that clonazepam is less addictive with less severe withdrawals because of the longer half life?

https://psychology.w...benzodiazepines
You can see from the table below clonazepam has the second smallest equivalency dose so it ranks as one of the strongest benzos. Its half life is sort of in the middle of the pack.

Drug Name    Common Brand Names    Elimination Half-Life  Therapeutic use    Approximate Equivalent Dose
Alprazolam Xanax,  6-12 hours anxiolytic 0.5 mg
Bromazepam Lexotanil, 10-20 hours anxiolytic 5-6 mg
Chlordiazepoxide Librium,  5-30 hours  anxiolytic 25 mg
Cinolazepam Gerodorm . 9 h hypnotic 40 mg
Clonazepam Klonopin,  18-50 hours anxiolytic, 0.5 mg
Clorazepate Tranxene [36-100 hours] anxiolytic, anticonvulsant 15 mg
Diazepam Valium, 20-100 hours [36-200] anxiolytic, anticonvulsant, muscle relaxant 10 mg
Estazolam ProSom 10-24 h hypnotic 1-2 mg
Flunitrazepam Rohypnol, 8-26 hours [36-200 hours] hypnotic 1 mg
Flurazepam Dalmadorm,  [40-250 hours] hypnotic 15-30 mg
Flutoprazepam Restas  60-90 hours hypnotic 2-3 mg
Halazepam Paxipam  [30-100 hours] anxiolytic 20-40 mg
Ketazolam Anxon  30-100 hours [36-200] anxiolytic 15-30 mg
Loprazolam Dormonoct 6-12 hours hypnotic 1-2 mg
Lorazepam Ativan,  10-20 hours anxiolytic,anticonvulsant 1 mg
Lormetazepam Loramet,  10-12 hours hypnotic 1-2 mg
Medazepam Nobrium  36-200 hours anxiolytic 10 mg
Midazolam , Versed,  3 hours (1.8-6 hours) hypnotic 5 -8mg
Nimetazepam Erimin 14-30 hours hypnotic 5 mg
Nitrazepam Mogadon,  15-38 hours hypnotic, anticonvulsant 10 mg
Nordazepam Madar,  50-120 hours anxiolytic 10 mg
Oxazepam Seresta, 4-15 hours anxiolytic 30 mg
Phenazepam феназепам  60 hours anxiolytic, anticonvulsant 1 mg
Pinazepam Domar  40-100 hours anxiolytic 20 mg
Prazepam Lysanxia,  36-200 hours anxiolytic 10-20 mg
Premazepam 10-13 hours anxiolytic 3.75 mg
Quazepam Doral 39-120 hours hypnotic 20 mg
Temazepam Restoril,  8-22 hours hypnotic 20 mg
Tetrazepam Mylostan 3-26 hours Skeletal muscle relaxant 100mg
Triazolam Halcion,  2 hours hypnotic 0.25 mg
Clobazam Frisium, 8-60 hours anxiolytic, anticonvulsant 20 mg
Flumazenil Anexate, 1 hour antidote Typical dose 0.2 - 0.6 mg
Eszopiclone Lunesta  6 hours  hypnotic  3 mg
Zaleplon  Sonata, 1 hours hypnotic  20 mg
Zolpidem| Ambien,  2.6 hours  hypnotic 20 mg
Zopiclone Imovane, 4-6 hours  hypnotic |15 mg

Most lists of "strongest benzos" are from forums. Medical drs rate benzo strength based on the affinity of the benzo to the gaba receptors and that is reflected in the equivalent dose table above.

Most doctors who have weighted in agree that number one is alprazolam and clonazepam and are followed by lorazepam.. Triazolam is actually the strongest but is not frequently used as it does not effect anxiety only is a hypnotic.

 

Most addictive - Flunitrazepam (Rohypnol) Clonazepam (Klonopin) Diazepam (Valium) Alprazolam (Xanax) Lorazepam (Ativan). Each person is slightly addictive but most drs agree with this list in general. Again, this is a reflection on the drugs affinity for the gaba receptor. Obviously Rohypnol (the date-rape drug) is illegal in most countries.

 

Withdrawal - Again most addiction websites and forum responses from people and drs say that it relates to affinity for the gaba sites. The lists usually mention Rohypnol first followed by Clonazepam , Alprazolam and Lorazepam.

[Mxpro32]

I slept from 11-6 last night. Longest stretch of sleep so far. I also felt alive yesterday for the first time in a while. It was like I woke up from a stupor and was feeling everything fully. It started with happiness and gratitude, then other emotions started coming at me. The full grief of my mom being dead hit me, then a bunch of vulnerabilities came at me rapid fire like my brain was warning me about the pain that can come when you are fully alive and not numb. It was an interesting experience.

[frog]

So glad you were finally able to get a full night's sleep. It's a magical thing when it happens. 

I hope you stick around on this forum for a while even as you get better. I look forward to your posts and seeing you get better as it gives me hope that I will be getting better as well (definitely doesn't feel like it a lot of the time)